out of the box theory

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yotamarker

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out of the box theory
« on: July 30, 2017, 05:54:53 pm »
if an algorithm or method cannot be easily explained or walkthroughed the complexity explained is a lie to cover up the truth.

such is the case with neural networks.
hence a strong indicator of cover up is silly university style formulas advanced mathematics and hyper nonsense.

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keghn

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2017, 08:20:39 pm »
  The science world does not know exactly how artificial neural network work.
  All they know is to input data and then adjust knobs on the black box until the output data is what they want.
  So science will not give an exact equation on how they work. 

 How AI detectives are cracking open the black box of deep learning: 
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/07/how-ai-detectives-are-cracking-open-black-box-deep-learning 

  A computer is a super flex machine. That can do allot of things. NN are not as flexible but can be wired in many many 
different ways to do the the same job. 
  So people learn the basics workings of single artificial neuron and. Then combined them until they get something that
 they like. A hands on approach.
  So there is no exact NN equations.

 But what they do is take in data and then output data.
 The can be trained take in the number seven then output the number five. For each specific input data it will
give a specific output data. If the black box is not trained to deal with input of six then no data will come out
until it is trained to deal with the number six. One black box can be trained to deal with 1000 input
values and generate a output value for each one. It is inefficient to have one black box to change just one
number into another. NN are data transformation algorithm and a universal approximators.




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yotamarker

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2017, 08:31:43 pm »
my theory is they use some simple algorithms and then they mask it with deep learning, neural networks, those diagrams of connected circles, s functions, and so on. if nature created it by a fluke, how complex can it really be ?

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keghn

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2017, 11:30:12 pm »
 One artificial neuron with 3 inputs one bias one output can take less than a second to train with just a CPU one thread.
 Once trained, it will take a millionth of a second to activate.

 Deep learning, which is a very big neural network. That is made with up to 1,000's of artificial neuron arranged  in a matrix
and then stacked in layer of to 5 or more, microsoft has one that is 250 layer deep. Deep neural network can deal with a lot
more information.
 They can take couple of days, non stop, to train them on 2 million pictures, 100 x 100 pixels, and using cpu only.
 Once trained they take a 2 seconds to activate. When it sees a bird it will activate 2 second later, printing
to the "sparrow" to the screen.
 GPU can speed everything up by a 1000 times faster!

 There are standard models pre trained deep networks that you can down load so you do not have do all the work.
Pre trained deep networks for dogs, birds, tree, and bushes and so on. And will need a computer with a really good
graphics card. Graphics cards have many GPU's on them working in parallel.


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LOCKSUIT

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2017, 02:42:34 am »
yotamarker is right. The algorithm is extremely simple. They cover it up with "oh you have to simulate neurons and networks etc".

It's so simple I won't bother saying it. Yous already know how AI works. RL.

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korrelan

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2017, 02:17:47 pm »


 :)
It thunk... therefore it is!

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yotamarker

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2017, 03:39:43 pm »
yes that video above is exactly what I'm talking about, I mean to see if a pixel is dark he went through those math sagas
I mean, are you kidding me ?!

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korrelan

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2017, 06:34:04 pm »
I think you are kind of missing the point lol.

 :)
It thunk... therefore it is!

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LOCKSUIT

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2017, 06:35:28 am »
Yes "those math SAGES". Exactly.

My AI will be able to learn to crawl etc without any neuro simulation NOR Genetic/Evolutionary Algorithms, seamlessly learning
« Last Edit: August 01, 2017, 03:37:29 pm by LOCKSUIT »

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Zero

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2017, 09:42:42 am »
Some people say "I could do it, it's so simple".

Some people simply do without saying any thing.

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selimchehimi

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2017, 11:43:34 am »
That's really interesting, the AI black box refers to AI systems that are so complicated that even the engineers who designed it are struggling to understand how it works. That could be a real problem to pursue the development of Artificial Intelligence so we must find ways of making AIs more understandable to their creators.

For example, last year, a strange experimental self-driving car was developed by Nvidia. It had nothing to do with other driverless cars because it relied entirely on an algorithm that had taught itself to drive by watching a human do it. This was tremendously impressive and it showed the rising power of AI. However, it wasn’t clear how the AI was making its own decisions...

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Zero

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2017, 02:24:47 pm »
Interesting indeed. This means Asimov-style hard-wired "laws" are a pure science-fiction artifact. A real-world AI can't be artificially limited in its choices. And understanding it will inevitably fall, one day, beyond what a human mind can compute. Still wanna play?

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korrelan

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2017, 03:10:47 pm »
Quote
This means Asimov-style hard-wired "laws" are a pure science-fiction artifact.

Yup!

Quote
A real-world AI can't be artificially limited in its choices.

Nope!

Quote
And understanding it will inevitably fall, one day, beyond what a human mind can compute.

Yup!

Quote
Still wanna play?

Bit late for that question lol.

 :)
It thunk... therefore it is!

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Zero

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2017, 04:12:08 pm »
 :D  ;D happily throwing hammers in the air

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korrelan

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Re: out of the box theory
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2017, 06:31:01 pm »
Haha.. Its not quite that bad… yet!.

I pretty sure you would have noticed by now that humankind has squarely set its sights on creating intelligent machines; big companies are pouring billions into research and they will want their returns. It’s happening now… like it or hate it… there is no stopping the momentum and humankind is heading for a new era were we are not the only highly intelligent species on this planet.

The stories you read about AGI dominance over the human race isn't even the worst case scenario. An AGI won’t need too start a nuclear war or kill billions of people.  We humans are mentally weak as a race; we are easily influenced and misguided.  Once an AGI understands how we ‘tick’ it will be able to use linguistic programming or ‘mental hacking’ against us… we won’t even know what hit us. Lol.

Luckily many are fumbling around in the dark working with deep neural nets/ convolutional networks, etc The major players in the AGI race are way off mark… so far as they let the public know.

It’s like Teddy Roosevelt said… “Do what you can, with what you have, where you are”.

Our only defence against something like this is a good offence… a better AGI.

Gone are the days of that warm fuzzy feeling whilst sleeping in our beds at night; this kind of event really makes you paws for thought.

A quick thought experiment. This will only work if you stick with the first thing that pops into your head… but the results are definitely worth bearing in mind.

Think of a soft child’s toy…

If you thought of a teddy bear you are doomed lol.

I knocked that up quickly to prove a point… some people really do fall for simple stuff like that… worrying isn't it.  We are our own worst enemy… an AGI would just use our weaknesses against us.

 :)
« Last Edit: August 01, 2017, 06:55:34 pm by korrelan »
It thunk... therefore it is!

 


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