[Zero]

Hi Freddy,

It would be great to have 2 additional sub-forums. I'm suggesting this, not because some existing messages are not where they belong, but rather to expand the scope of AIDream.

The first one would be about Human Computer Interaction (HCI). An AI lives in a computer, hence it seems logical to have a place to discuss the means to interact with it. The other one is spirituality. I know... it's hot. But IMO there's a lot to learn from it. We're trying to reach human level (at least), and spirituality is clearly an important part of what makes mankind what it is, hence it seems logical not to shy away from this.

I just propose we give these 2 new areas a try. After a few months, if you think AIDream is better without them, well messages inside of them can easily be relocated, and these sub-forums deleted...

What do you think, Freddy? Guys?

[infurl]

There isn't an existing sub-forum that's a perfect fit for human computer interaction but on the other hand it is covered generally by several of the existing sub-forums.

I would have said that spirituality is right off topic except that recent research suggests that it might actually be due to a side-effect of consciousness. In other words, spirituality and religion are due to a bug in our mental software. Anyway, here's the article should anyone wish to read it.

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2016/06/how-consciousness-evolved/485558/

[Korrelan]

I agree with Infurl.

Personal belief systems should be avoided.  The topic is already adding to the complexity of writing this reply, I'm having to be extra careful not to ‘offend’ anyone.

We are all members because we have a common understanding/ interest.  We ground our projects/ research/ discussions on commonly understood concepts.

‘Spirituality’ is a very personal phenomenon and gives no common ground for group discussion.  It also has a lot of unavoidable emotional ties that form my experience never results in a satisfactory outcome. 

Also… everything we write/ express on this forum effects how the other members portray us.  We build a mental picture of the person we are conversing with based on past conversations and this affects our opinion of that person, best to keep it on friendly/ professional level.

Life’s rules #42. Don’t try to fix what isn't broken.

Life’s rules #47. Never discuss politics or religion/ spirituality with a peer if you want to remain friends. Lol.

 

[Zero]

I knew the answer before asking the question. And I knew infurl would be the first saying "no".

I feel more and more I don't belong here, which means I belong nowhere on the web. Not only because of this rejected suggestion.

[Korrelan]

I knew the answer before asking the question.

Then you were just trying to elicit a negative response? 

And I knew infurl would be the first saying "no".

You are expressing your personal opinion about a member of the forum.  Now I don’t have the information or beliefs that you have behind your personal opinion, so I have to make my own judgement on what you are trying to express about Infurl.  My experience of Infurl is totally different to yours… shall we argue about who is right? 

Is your personal opinion about Inful relevant to the topics of this forum? It could also be construed as a personal attack.

If I went to a ‘spiritual’ forum and told them that what they believe to be a true fact is just a side-effect of their consciousness… all hell would break loose lol. 

I feel more and more I don't belong here, which means I belong nowhere on the web.

You are a valuable member of this forum, as is Infurl.

If you have some facet of your consciousness/ personality that needs to be expressed then find a suitable outlet/ forum and talk to like minded people.  This is an AI forum not a faith; accept it for what it is.

From my experience serious AI researchers are very rarely deeply spiritual, and for good reason… if you don’t believe AI is an engineering/ programming/ science problem then there is no point trying to achieve/ build it.

Don’t try to mix oil and water.

 

[ivan.moony]

I feel more and more I don't belong here, which means I belong nowhere on the web. Not only because of this rejected suggestion.

Don't be so dark mooded. We like that you are here, around.

[Zero]

About infurl, I didn't mean anything negative. I was just mentionning an intuition I've had when I posted the message. But you're right, this sentence is completely irrelevant, and since it could be misunderstood, I should not have written it. I think infurl is a valuable member of this forum, and his answer was ok.

About the topic, I wasn't trying to elicit a negative answer. I was just expressing a sincere desire, about expanding the forum scope (not fixing it).

When you say "talk to link-minded people", I feel bad. I may be wrong, but I believe that 90% members here:
- think singularity can happen
- see transhumanism as a good thing
- think AIs should be slaves
- consider spirituality is off-topic
...etc. So yeah, I'm wondering "am I like-minded", do I belong here?

I love this forum, I love members here... I'm ready to cry.

Thanks ivan.moony.

[Zero]

Let's close this topic and talk about something else.

[ivan.moony]

I do my best, and I'm sorry if that is not enough for you 

We should try to accept differences. Being different puts us in a special place where we have an opportunity to drift community in the way of our vision. But not everyone are ready to listen, and that shouldn't discourage us. Nature is a bitch, it is still a survival of the strongest, not the smartest, but knowing that, we could be that part of the nature that shines on among the mud, no matter how odd we are being called. If we loose our patience, that means we are giving up, which darkens the spot that shined because of us. We have a power to make this world a better place to live in. Let's use it without expecting that everything will vortex around us. Something surely will, and that should be just enough for us.

[Zero]

Thank you again ivan.moony, you make me feel better.

[Korrelan]

I'm sure Infurl understands lol.

In the interest of good relations I’ll let your derogatory comments slide on this occasion Ivan.

 

[Art]

With all due respect, this forum is about all things digital and AI, Robotic, Transhumanism (advancing the human condition through the use of advanced technologies), The Singularity, Machine learning, Chatbots, Science Fiction, etc.

Generally unless a Forum is specifically geared toward either Religion or Politics (and there are a vast assortment of them), it's best practice to avoid bringing those topics into the mix. That's not why we're here nor what we're about.

For spirituality, one might wish to explore Wiccan websites and holistic spiritualist, yoga, mind & body sites, etc. Religions of all flavors if that's your pick are plentiful. Google them or similar searches.

While your ideas are certainly understood, please understand that this is not the place to entertain them.

I do not speak for the entire staff and management of our forum but as a Mod and a fellow human being and as such, I do wish you well and extend good thoughts!

[ivan.moony]

I'm sure Infurl understands lol.

In the interest of good relations I’ll let your derogatory comments slide on this occasion Ivan.

 

Korrelan! Not funny. The comment is meant to reflect the internal attitude than everyone of us could have, without picking any sides. I'm sorry if you recognized anyone at the opposite side. Don't tell me you didn't do anything good and bad in your life. We all did. It is a shine and a mud in our relations, not pointing to anyone specifically. When I'm in a melancholic mood, this is exactly what I'd like to hear, so I'm sorry for being honest for this occasion.

The guy asked us something. We stopped it. Should he call us a light in his life? And leave Infurl out of this, it is about all of us, including darn me.

[Zero]

With all due respect, this forum is about all things digital and AI, Robotic, Transhumanism (advancing the human condition through the use of advanced technologies), The Singularity, Machine learning, Chatbots, Science Fiction, etc.

Ooops.

I didn't notice this forum was also about transhumanism and the singularity.

My bad.

Please don't go flame war. You can't come in a well established community and ask them to change what the community orbits around.

I just didn't know. I thought it was AI only, and chatbots. Now I know it's a community of people who hope singularity and transhumanism. I don't belong here.

[Korrelan]

Haha… calm Ivan

The... ‘I’m sure Infurl understands’ was in regard to the earlier comments not my last one. As in I'm sure Infurl is wise enough to understand Zero's misgivings.

I understood you perfectly; I suppose my humour was misplaced and I must admit I have no idea what a melancholic mood feels like.

Anyway I’m just glad everyone is feeling rosy again.

Peace gentlemen 

@Zero

Edit. This forum covers a wide topic base, this just means the subjects are open for discussion... not that we all 'believe' in them.  Why not start a thread and find out what your fellow peers opinions are regarding the other topics.

 

There can be no light… without the dark.