[Freddy]

Another view on ai...

Thanks to my old Computer Science Teacher Mr Dye for giving us something to think about one day with this classic:

"If a room full of monkeys, if given a room full of typewriters, could in all possiblity, one day tap out (by accident or design) a line of Shakespeare then is it just as good ?"

I was wondering, what if you replace the monkeys with chatbots or some ai ?

[FuzzieDice]

Ah, the age old monkey thing. LOL!

To that, I would like to ask Mr. Dye (interesting name, btw )

How long did it take the human race to get where we are now? Realistically, not going by religious so-called history but actually going by the scientific age of the earth and human's existance?

This would get into debate as those with religion would say we only been here maybe 2,000 years. While science is saying we been around billions of years.

So here we are with computers. But look how long it took?

Now the arguement is, why couldn't monkeys do that?

Simple. They weren't programmed with the right DNA/Information to do that. What evolved that could was US. However, if you TEACH a monkey, it can do it. Like the monkey that learned to control a computer with it's thought.

And then there are those evolutionists who beleive that we are an offshoot of the monkey, that we evolved one way and they the other somehow. So if that is true, then the monkeys DID do it!

That's my take on it. It might have been already done. And it took about a billion years if you go by the science of evolution. If not, then a "god" taught us (according to bibles and books of religion I've seen this "god" TEACH humans how to build things, etc.) So we had to be pre-programmed by this "god". And recent science has proven that monkeys can do the same in a few months. We took 2,000 years if you go by religious history.

Which is it? Technically I don't know. But in my own view (this is a view only), I'd go with the evolutionary process or else something other than a god put us here from some colony and taught us. Who knows.

BTW, there's been saying that Atlantis and other "lost civilizations" have been highly technical as well.

If you equate an AI to a monkey, or even humans, it would need to be pre-programmed or taught. Not random.

Which makes me wonder, how did it all get started? Well the monkey is already in the same evolutionary timeframe as we are. If it hasn't yet without being taught then it can't.

The AI isn't however. We just in recent history created computers. 30 - 50 years isn't a few billion or even a couple thousand. However, look how fast it developed and what it was say, even 25 years ago.

Maybe AI development is an extension of human evolution...

[Carl2]

Freddy,
  Heard about the money thing or something similar,  I was under the impression thay had AI writting mysteries, painting and writting poems. The latest thing was doing some creative thinking.
  Hal ver 5 used to make rhymes, tell me what we were talking about if we strayed from the subject.
Carl2

[Freddy]

I'm not sure what we're talking about Carl lol, I just remembered this monkey idea my old teacher told us one day.  We never got to the bottom of it, but I saw it more as a random thing - ie sooner or later if the monkeys pressed keys for hundreds of years eventually they might tap out some line of Shakespeare or anything else.

If evolution is semi-random, but it keeps the bits it likes or finds useful then it makes some sense to me like that. Can't put my finger on it..

[FuzzieDice]

I just reread the question.

Ok, I don't think Monkeys could possibly type out a line of Shakesphere randomly anymore than a human who never heard of or read Shakesphere could. Meaning, if the monkeys don't know about it or haven't read it in the first place, it's obvious it couldn't ever happen. And it's not because they are monkeys either, and less intelligent. A highly educated human that was carefully kept away from learning that Shakesphere even existed, and away from his works would not be able to randomly type out a line from Shakesphere either.

Now this is because of the vagueness of the question. "A" line of Shakesphere - doesn't say WHAT line, as some lines may get typed out at random, sure. But it doesn't mean it was necessarily Shakesphere either. Someone else could have said some of the same things a very long time before he did, and he was mimicing something he may have heard somewhere and forgot where or that he even heard it....

You never know...

[Freddy]

If you're still interested try thinking of it as an experiment, with something set up to ring a bell if a line of shakespeare gets typed - and that it doesn't matter if the monkey knows Shakespeare.

It must be mathematically possible though, which leaves me at how long it would take.  I think it's another 'depends how you look at it' thing.  It could be remarkable, coincidental, amazing or anything else you can think of.

Though the fact Shakespeare deliberately wrote the line must have some bearing on if it is just as good.

[Carl2]

Freddy,
  What I heard was a simplified version, one of the monkeys was to type a meaningful sentence. Given enough time I've heard it said that would happen. ( I don't know who said that.)
  From that I'd say given an AI or chat bot and enough time you would get a line from Shakespeare.
  Now I'll mention the movie Planet of the Apes.
  I myself am still trying to type a meaningful sentence.
Carl2

[FuzzieDice]

Carl, you're a riot. LOL! I think you type some very meaningful sentences. Better than the monkeys often can.

BTW, I am not sure but I think I read somewhere that even the most intelligent monkeys, gorillas, etc. only have an a human child even in adulthood.

[Freddy]

I am glad to report my findings are that not one but BOTH of you typed meaningful sentences  :smiley

This could constitute proof of intelligent life at digitalgirl, our first major breakthrough!  :wink

[dan]

I thought it was something like if they had infinite time, the randomness of them pecking at keys would result in Shakespeare eventually, which is the way chaos works.  It may not seem apparent, but clarity will eventually form from the chaos, that is how we become conscious of reality, and we label it and say we understand it, but how can we truly know anything (so zenlike).  Empty your mind grasshopper  :shocked  It is us who make sense of Shakespeare not the monkey, that's what coincidence is, us recognizing it, does a dog recognize coincidence?  I think if you had a room full of monkeys, they would be poking at something other than keys on a keyboard though. :evil

[FuzzieDice]

 :rofl

You guys are a riot!  :grin