In our likeness or...grow your own?

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Art

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In our likeness or...grow your own?
« on: December 06, 2007, 12:10:01 am »
I was going to post this article in "The Future of AI" but had some reservations so here it is:
It is both intriguing and scary at the same time when one thinks of future ramifications of
such research / technology.
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Here you are...
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I am creating artificial life, declares US gene pioneer
· Scientist has made synthetic chromosome
· Breakthrough could combat global warming
 
Ed Pilkington in New York The Guardian, Saturday October 6 2007 Craig Venter, the controversial DNA researcher involved in the race to decipher the human genetic code, has built a synthetic chromosome out of laboratory chemicals and is poised to announce the creation of the first new artificial life form on Earth.

The announcement, which is expected within weeks and could come as early as Monday at the annual meeting of his scientific institute in San Diego, California, will herald a giant leap forward in the development of designer genomes. It is certain to provoke heated debate about the ethics of creating new species and could unlock the door to new energy sources and techniques to combat global warming.

Mr Venter told the Guardian he thought this landmark would be "a very important philosophical step in the history of our species. We are going from reading our genetic code to the ability to write it. That gives us the hypothetical ability to do things never contemplated before".

The Guardian can reveal that a team of 20 top scientists assembled by Mr Venter, led by the Nobel laureate Hamilton Smith, has already constructed a synthetic chromosome, a feat of virtuoso bio-engineering never previously achieved. Using lab-made chemicals, they have painstakingly stitched together a chromosome that is 381 genes long and contains 580,000 base pairs of genetic code.

The DNA sequence is based on the bacterium Mycoplasma genitalium which the team pared down to the bare essentials needed to support life, removing a fifth of its genetic make-up. The wholly synthetically reconstructed chromosome, which the team have christened Mycoplasma laboratorium, has been watermarked with inks for easy recognition.

It is then transplanted into a living bacterial cell and in the final stage of the process it is expected to take control of the cell and in effect become a new life form. The team of scientists has already successfully transplanted the genome of one type of bacterium into the cell of another, effectively changing the cell's species. Mr Venter said he was "100% confident" the same technique would work for the artificially created chromosome.

The new life form will depend for its ability to replicate itself and metabolise on the molecular machinery of the cell into which it has been injected, and in that sense it will not be a wholly synthetic life form. However, its DNA will be artificial, and it is the DNA that controls the cell and is credited with being the building block of life.

Mr Venter said he had carried out an ethical review before completing the experiment. "We feel that this is good science," he said. He has further heightened the controversy surrounding his potential breakthrough by applying for a patent for the synthetic bacterium.

Pat Mooney, director of a Canadian bioethics organisation, ETC group, said the move was an enormous challenge to society to debate the risks involved. "Governments, and society in general, is way behind the ball. This is a wake-up call - what does it mean to create new life forms in a test-tube?"

He said Mr Venter was creating a "chassis on which you could build almost anything. It could be a contribution to humanity such as new drugs or a huge threat to humanity such as bio-weapons".

Mr Venter believes designer genomes have enormous positive potential if properly regulated. In the long-term, he hopes they could lead to alternative energy sources previously unthinkable. Bacteria could be created, he speculates, that could help mop up excessive carbon dioxide, thus contributing to the solution to global warming, or produce fuels such as butane or propane made entirely from sugar.

"We are not afraid to take on things that are important just because they stimulate thinking," he said. "We are dealing in big ideas. We are trying to create a new value system for life. When dealing at this scale, you can't expect everybody to be happy."
In the world of AI, it's the thought that counts!

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Maviarab

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Re: In our likeness or...grow your own?
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2007, 01:05:12 am »
Woah...excellent find Art...and agreed...scary yet very interesting...

One wonders (or I do at least) is this playing with nature a little too much?

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Freddy

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Re: In our likeness or...grow your own?
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2007, 01:56:25 pm »
Good find Art.  Very interesting, I only hope that they will use it beneficially.  It's a lot like the Frankenstein story - do they really have any idea about what they may create.

Mav...'playing with nature a little too much'...hmm, I think it could be...that question gets asked with some regularity whenever a new 'breakthrough' reaches the general public.  I speculate that this question always goes unanswered.

It would be really nice to have safe fuels.  They have already made a car that runs on a hydrogen cell (General Motors Sequel) which only emits water.  One way or another I am glad something is being done about this.  Maybe this new possibility will also be a good thing to explore - cheap fuel that is safe for the environment has to be a good thing.  If a new kind of fuel is available at the right price then finally some of the world' s biggest polluting countries out there would start to sort their act out and stop ruining the environment for the rest of us.

I think the worst aspect is the notion of it being used to create bioweapons.  At this stage though, creating this basic lifeform in itself seems to be outside the boundaries of what most people will care about.  I mean we would care more if it were something that crawled around on all fours or was cute and furry.  I suspect this isn't going to stop here though.  Maybe though, they can bring back some of the animals we have exterminated like the Dodo or the Passenger pigeon.  Now if we could start to make ammends this way then that would truly be something.

So to me this is a double edged sword, we just need to be sure the right kind of people wield it.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2007, 02:18:04 pm by Freddy »

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Maviarab

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Re: In our likeness or...grow your own?
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2007, 03:04:20 pm »
Heh guess I should have gone into a little more detaul (was late though)  ;D

Quote
Mav...'playing with nature a little too much'...hmm, I think it could be...that question gets asked with some regularity whenever a new 'breakthrough' reaches the general public.  I speculate that this question always goes unanswered.

Is the age old question of ethics amongst others. Nature 'or' God, whichever you prefer created things as they were and are. Is it really our place to changing things that could condlict with (nature 'or' God, whichever you prefer) ? Therte are numerous others that on the surface appear to have many benefits, IVF being one, cloning sheep for food another, is this messing around too much, or is it our place as an evolviing species to do this?

Quote
So to me this is a double edged sword, we just need to be sure the right kind of people wield it.

The people who weild it will undoubtably be people in power, and people in power are never the right people to wield it.

Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutly.

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Freddy

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Re: In our likeness or...grow your own?
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2007, 03:31:11 pm »
Quote
Is the age old question of ethics amongst others. Nature 'or' God, whichever you prefer created things as they were and are. Is it really our place to changing things that could condlict with (nature 'or' God, whichever you prefer) ? Therte are numerous others that on the surface appear to have many benefits, IVF being one, cloning sheep for food another, is this messing around too much, or is it our place as an evolviing species to do this?

Well we have been doing this for thousands of years, but like I said the question of whether we should often seems to get brushed aside.  Should we have said 'no' to penicillin ?  Should we not make robotic limbs for the disabled ?  Should we clone animals for our benefits ?  Should we have picked up the sword to fight ?  Should we drive around in cars that pollute the atmosphere ?  These are all things that to some degree alter the 'natural' or 'divine' order of things.

The big question has never stopped us it seems, but it's possible to see that some developments may be for the greater good.  Mostly we learn to take the rough with the smooth.  The human race always moves on for good or bad.  Thats why my answer hoped for the enlightened use of this technology and science.

The thing is (taking a point above) that penicillin didn't corrupt but biological weapons may well corrupt.  So that's still my answer - it could be good and bad, we just have to be hopeful that good sense prevails for the most part.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2007, 03:46:20 pm by Freddy »

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Maviarab

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Re: In our likeness or...grow your own?
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2007, 04:23:36 pm »
Quote
we just have to be hopeful that good sense prevails for the most

We always live in hope, when we lose that its game over  >:(

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Art

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Re: In our likeness or...grow your own?
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2007, 09:35:25 pm »
I think another important factor to consider is will the scientists attempt to have or maintain a
"controlled" development or accept a mutation under the old, "So long as it's doing something"
school of thought??

Controlled growth = good
Mutation = bad

Ultimately for what purpose becomes the next question and at what cost...not monetarily, but
as far as possible ramifications are concerned.

Does anyone actually benefit or is it just a means to an end (like a nice Nobel Prize for Science)
and a lot of lucretive offers?

That's kind of why I entitled the Subject the way I did. It can be seen from both sides...religious
and scientific.

Right or wrong, good or bad, it will continue and in the end, like with most things, the only
ultimate judge of it all will be God.

In the world of AI, it's the thought that counts!

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Freddy

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Re: In our likeness or...grow your own?
« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2007, 12:54:52 pm »
Quote
I think another important factor to consider is will the scientists attempt to have or maintain a
"controlled" development or accept a mutation under the old, "So long as it's doing something"
school of thought??

Yes I agree that is a major point.  It begs the question of whether these new lifeforms will be under the dominion of God or Man.  Of course it's probably going to be the latter as nothing much has ever stopped us deciding the fate of other living organisms.

I think controlled growth seems the most acceptable, because scientists may be less aware of the consequence of growing mutations.  Who knows what they could be capable of.

In response to your other points Art, I think I would only be convinced at the moment I was at the petrol station pouring safe fuel into my car.  I am inclined to think that then and only then should they start giving out the prizes.

Mav, yes we have hope still.

« Last Edit: December 07, 2007, 03:05:15 pm by Freddy »

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Maviarab

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Re: In our likeness or...grow your own?
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2007, 05:17:00 pm »
To fast forward somewhat in terms of ramifications...lets take murder...

In I Robot (review to come)...the letter of the law says, murder can only be committed by a human on another human...

So, uopn ramifications, depending on how sci-fi into the future you wish to think, our whole legal system could be challeged.

 


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