Ai Dreams Forum
Member's Experiments & Projects => General Project Discussion => Topic started by: AndyGoode on September 22, 2019, 04:52:55 pm
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I'm working on an article on a new topic related to knowledge representation that I hope to finish in a week, but I'm running into a few situations where I could use some input.
The easiest chore I need done is to come up with an appealing, practical, visual name for the peanut shape. The real shape I'm trying to describe is like those old-fashioned barbells/dumbbells with a sphere at each end and a bar connecting them...
(https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/cartoon-strongman-holding-barbell-illustration-93952594.jpg)
...or an oxygen molecule with a single link between the atoms...
(https://c8.alamy.com/comp/PR3JWF/oxygen-o2-molecule-model-and-chemical-formula-also-dioxygen-diatomic-or-molecular-oxygen-ball-and-stick-model-geometric-structure-and-formula-PR3JWF.jpg)
...or the P2 graph from graph theory, the ones in this diagram...
(https://i.stack.imgur.com/bJq2X.jpg)
...although it resembles a peanut or electron p-orbital. Is there something in nature like a plant or internal organ that has this shape that would lend a catchy, inoffensive name to be used as a technical term in graph theory?
I could also use some heavier expertise in graph theory, such as...
Is there already a name in graph theory for the peanut shape I'm seeking?
If a weighted and labeled edge exists, must it be considered a double edge? Is there an advantage to using simple graphs over double edge graphs?
Is there a list somewhere of many extensions of graphs that have been used, such as colored graphs, marked graphs, bipartite graphs, graphs with print commands like in Turing machine representations, etc.?
Is there a list somewhere with the various measures or statuses of a graph, such as chromatic number, presence of a Hamiltonian circuit, average degree, etc.?
Is there a name or theory for graphs with grouped elements, where the group itself has an outgoing arc?
I wouldn't mind giving name credit in the article to anyone who can supply any suggestions I decide to use. There is a good chance I'll post a link to my final article on this site.
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Wheels on an axel:
(https://i.ibb.co/BwqCX10/wz1-wak-42-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jHgrcpn)
Glasses:
(https://i.ibb.co/kHyQgyd/51x4pr0z-I5-L-UX679.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dWcG0ch)
I don't know about finding this in nature. I could only find continuous things, like dew on a spiderweb.
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H.S.,
Thanks for the attempt. However, it should be a single, catchy, visual word that very accurately describes that shape.
p-orbital - not catchy
P2 - not catchy
O2 - not catchy
dumbbell - possibly offensive
wheels on an axle - not a single word
glasses - ambiguous
peanut - not accurate
bolas - possibly offensive
Q-tip - trademark
etc.
By default I'll use the word 'peanut', but the shape I'm describing is not really a peanut shape since the connecting rod is thin, so I'd like to find another word. I've looked in a few graph theory books and online but I can't find anything on those topics I mentioned.
bolas
(https://secure.img2-fg.wfcdn.com/im/33670188/resize-h400-w400%5Ecompr-r85/6302/63029739/Replacement+Bolas+Ladder+Ball.jpg)
clackers
(https://cdn.instructables.com/F08/M416/GYQERYTI/F08M416GYQERYTI.RECT2100.jpg)
cherries
(https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/x/pair-cherries-3534423.jpg)
Q-tips
(https://ryanmotors.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/q-tips.jpg)
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Connected bi nodes or... Conbinode
:)
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Nice try, Korr. That doesn't sound visual enough or catchy enough to me, though.
kayak paddle
(https://www.sheridanmarine.com/public/assets/images/shop/stock/1309474800/sevylor-adventurer-kayak-paddle-1310056627-l.jpg)
martini olives
(https://st.depositphotos.com/1799455/1705/i/450/depositphotos_17059733-stock-photo-olives-on-a-toothpick.jpg)
seesaw
(https://aidreams.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fecx.images-amazon.com%2Fimages%2FI%2F31iZhSQI1cL.jpg&hash=36a1fbb5399079c99ce400bea8c0b53357d74b75)
seashell bikini top ;)
(https://ind5.ccio.co/71/aF/J9/eed3c62f3f4cf86800eca800aa24dc19.jpg)
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Is this a piece of hardware for storing memory on a computer?
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My first thought was, "why in the world are you calling that a peanut shape? It's a dumbbell shape. Obviously."
I know it's possible to use that word as an insult, but if you're not applying it to a *person,* nobody should think you're being insulting. And no one seems to have invented a more polite alternative name for the exercise equipment, so it can't be all that rude.
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Is this a piece of hardware for storing memory on a computer?
No, it's completely theoretical, to describe what graphs can represent. It's related to applied AI in that rule-based expert systems use something like that already, with an antecedent and consequent connected by implication.
(https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/images/3/39/solar_panels.png)
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Is this a piece of hardware for storing memory on a computer?
No, it's completely theoretical, to describe what graphs can represent. It's related to applied AI in that rule-based expert systems use something like that already, with an antecedent and consequent connected by implication.
(https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/images/3/39/solar_panels.png)
Did u realize that flow charts can be a way to go about a.i. - like that can also be a sport or a game, like how to play back jack, or how to play soccer, or boxing, or even hearding sheep or other farm work!!! it may be a bit predictable and redundant, but itll definitely be able to do it. (unless u already know.)
Then after the flow chart is made, and scrutinized that its actually correct, the hard thing after that is, trying to get the robot to actually follow the flow chart properly, where all the a.i. wizardry would go.
That's what im going to do. :D I see a great future here for "dumbish" type robots sorta, but they actually do useful things, and besides, it hasn't even come out yet even something this simple... so its on the cutting edge, even tho its simple!
goes to show how dumb the industry is, its pathetic... sorry for being a bit arrogant there, but im not taking that back.
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My first thought was, "why in the world are you calling that a peanut shape? It's a dumbbell shape. Obviously."
It *used* to be a dumbbell shape. Nowadays, though, dumbbells usually look like this, all squarish...
(https://target.scene7.com/is/image/Target/GUEST_92c7fe03-36c6-4ce1-b3e3-9ff5c99446bf?wid=700&hei=700&fmt=webp)
(https://www.makro.co.za/sys-master/images/hca/h89/8908883001374/silo-MIN_342549_EAA_large)
That's why I mentioned that *old-fashioned* dumbbells looked like that. However, your suggestion is a very good one. If you think people won't be confused or offended then 'dumbbell' is fine with me. What do you and other people think?
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Did u realize that flow charts can be a way to go about a.i.
Yes, I realized that, but only in a certain way, where each step of a flowchart could output a boolean value to be used in the next step of the chart. But now that you mention it, I can see how the flowchart-like diagram I posted could be easily converted to a rule-based system.
It's unfortunate that the best diagram I found online to illustrate my meaning was more like a flowchart. Here's a better diagram, although the rules appear as squares instead of circles or rounded squares...
(https://aidreams.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ftraders.com%2FDocumentation%2FFEEDbk_docs%2F2003%2F03%2FAbstracts_new%2FvonRonik%2FRonikF1.gif&hash=683995d5080ef1472a0d1f0bcb1046e0a86ba0f7)
For example, the top left-hand link from D1 to D2, if you included D1 and D2 themselves, would be a single dumbbell.
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I don't know if itll be of use to you, since everyone should like their own design the best, but the way I perceive this flow chart bot, is each node is actually the robot in a different state - and its in more of a classical finite state machine.
(https://scontent.fper6-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/70584977_999955047019219_5997763808427245568_o.jpg?_nc_cat=105&_nc_oc=AQk6ZgI5-geDfezVKy9MDTQjtD5oy2x75fwzTieS69-xR4xy6L0HgmmsgXp5v2zXh5o&_nc_ht=scontent.fper6-1.fna&oh=f8d892e72e34b26848f13296b8b52e00&oe=5E33A4BF)
I didn't take very long to draw that up, but youd have to include all the states out of the robot truck onto the field and back again. :)
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the way I perceive this flow chart bot, is each node is actually the robot in a different state - and its in more of a classical finite state machine.
Now you're getting closer to what I'm working on. Yes, your diagram is called a DFA, or deterministic finite state automaton, and is very useful in many domains, especially in computer applications, though you may have made some minor alterations from a typical DFA. What you are doing in general is representing knowledge. Whether diagramming a DFA, Turing machine, expert system rule, neural network, or other concept, a graph of some sort is usually used. Now you see why I was asking if there exists some list of all such extensions of such graphs: the nature of knowledge is not fully understood, but if everyone seems to be using graphs to represent knowledge, there may well be a common thread between all their specific representations, and a 'super-graph' that incorporated all the known graph extensions might be very powerful indeed.
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Ah DFA, I can add another acronym to my reportiore, thankyou. Deterministic Finite Automata. Would be great for a nano-bot, and he bullies all the micro-animals around. :)
I was just checking if you knew about it or not, I think its a cool idea.
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That's why I mentioned that *old-fashioned* dumbbells looked like that. However, your suggestion is a very good one. If you think people won't be confused or offended then 'dumbbell' is fine with me. What do you and other people think?
Dumbbells seem like a good choice. I googled "dumbbells offensive" and only got results saying that they could be an offensive weapon. Otherwise the word can be used as an insult in slang, but as far as I can tell that use hasn't tarnished the actual noun in popular culture. Could still happen down the line though.
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Dumbbells seem like a good choice.
Thanks for your opinion. It just occurred to me the irony of using the word 'dumbbell' for the foundations of artificial intelligence. :)
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Ah DFA, I can add another acronym to my reportiore, thankyou. Deterministic Finite Automata.
It's odd, but when they taught us DFAs in school they called them deterministic finite *state* automata, but then abbreviated them DFA instead of DFSA, which I always thought was weird. But times have changed, now Wikipedia exists, and Wikipedia mentions both abbreviations and both full terms.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deterministic_finite_automaton
Normally DFAs have a special start state and special stop state, just like flowcharts, and they need some symbol like 'yes' or 'no' or '0' or '1' written on the arc to transition to another state, which are some of the minor ways your chart is different from a true DFA, but then I'm a 'prickly person.' :)