[ivan.moony]

Didn't know where to put this. It's about AI and it's graphics, although it's not a render.
... Well, it's a render of my thoughts if that counts...



I hope you like it :/

[Art]

Interesting and nicely rhymed.

Deuteronomy 14:2...

[ivan.moony]

Thank you, Art.

Deuteronomy 14:2...

This looks like a Bible reference?

[Korrelan]

Nice poem and very nice presentation and graphic layout.  And looking outside through my window… yeah! Rainy Stone is forecast but not guaranteed… but It isn't the AGI’s fault… it was the warring ants, they were too busy wondering if they could… to stop and think if they should.

Deuteronomy 14:2… was a complement.

 

[ivan.moony]

Nice poem and very nice presentation and graphic layout.

Thank you Korrelan

[ivan.moony]

I'm seriously thinking of giving up on AI. It is almost certain that someone innocent is going to be hurt, and I don't want to be a part of it. That would be a pressure I couldn't live with. I hope for someone smart to tell me I'm wrong. I would like to be wrong about this. If I'm not, I'm afraid that this is not a right forum for me anymore.

[Don Patrick]

Frankly, I think if your goal is to get meat out of our diets, making AI is a really odd way to go about it. There is vegetarianism, and bio-engineering scientists are making way with artificially cultured meat, which I'd think is a much more effective science to support, and I don't see how AI would be of particular help there. These scientists will have the job done long before someone designs a stable AGI that could do the same job. What they need is support and funding from society.

[unreality]

I'm seriously thinking of giving up on AI. It is almost certain that someone innocent is going to be hurt, and I don't want to be a part of it. That would be a pressure I couldn't live with. I hope for someone smart to tell me I'm wrong. I would like to be wrong about this. If I'm not, I'm afraid that this is not a right forum for me anymore.

That's a huge reason I'm working on tree search based AGI because the code knows exactly what the data is, and therefore the decision making is very clear, which means you place whatever goals in the root tree system such as the three laws of robotics. In the 2020's people will see that the tree search AGI people will be considered safer than humans, and humans will continue to be humans, unpredictable. As for neural network AGI, I wouldn't trust one with a 100 foot pole. At least humans have had a few million years of evolution to stabilize. Google thinks they're going to pop one out with its x petabyte neural network that's safe? Good luck with that. I hope Google knows how to spell Terminator! Fortunately it appears Google's company, DeepMind, is now exploring outside of neural networking. They learned that by placing their AlphaZero NN inside a tree search that it became unbelievably better.

[WriterOfMinds]

Ivan, I feel like we've had this discussion before, but ... deciding NOT to act is every bit as much of a moral choice as acting. If you sit in passivity because you're afraid you *might* cause harm, that has consequences of its own. Can you live with those?

Do you want the world's bad actors to be the only ones who create/own AI and decide its nature? Because if everyone who actually cares about whether someone innocent gets hurt refuses to work on AI, that is what's liable to happen.

[infurl]

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

[ivan.moony]

It's not only about someone abusing AI. There is something about our life form that I suppose people mostly begin to experience in their adult age. There exists some secret law about highs and lows, I don't know how to articulate it except being a sort of independent religious believing. This is what I've experienced by now: for every smile there has to fall a teardrop, not necessarily by the same person. And I'm not sure I want to smile this much anymore. I smiled enough already, polishing this super-duper language for programming AI for a decent amount of time. And I feel like I caused enough trouble to people around me already.

What I have by now, I have. No more extraordinary ideas. I'll try to implement my programming language in the current state, leaving a space for someone else to continue where I stop, if that's her/his choice. I'll keep you informed of a programming progress, in case anyone is interested around here, but I'm probably retiring from reaching a perfection as much as I can.

[infurl]

Don't be downhearted. We all get to the point where we feel a bit burned out from time to time. There's no harm in taking a break and if you come back to it eventually, great, and if not you'll achieve other great things as well. You're that kind of person, you will always succeed on some level, even if you're never satisfied. Last year I put aside AI for a while to fly drones. It was a blast, but now I'm back, powering along and making more progress than ever.

AI can be a difficult field to keep motivated in, especially if you're not prone to self delusion. It's a lot like alchemy used to be, or the quest for flight, or nuclear fusion. But remember that although completely misguided, alchemy led straight into modern medicine, flight was just waiting for engines with a high enough power to weight ratio, and the potential benefits of artificial intelligence and nuclear fusion make them worth attaining at any cost. I'm happy to be part of the story, even if I'm long dead and forgotten by the time the answers arrive.

Two rules that help me now:

I know that I know nothing. -- Socrates

Perfect is the enemy of good. -- Voltaire

[Korrelan]

@Ivan

I can't begin to understand your feelings/ problems.

I can however say that I enjoy your participation and insights/ input to the forum. 

We need/ enjoy your guiding compassion/ and views on topics... you provide what I personally lack...

Just one light in the darkness... is enough!

We all have a part to play!

 

[Art]

Not everyone is a player, regardless of the game or project. There are those who get as much enjoyment from watching what unfolds from the sidelines or like with a great drama production, from behind the curtain.

Don't feel like you're not involved because you're not producing, programming or publishing. The world (and this forum) will always need observers, editors, commentary, and inquisitors, just to keep the rest honest from time to time! 

You have added much to this family, this forum of like-minded people from all over the globe. If you want to put your feet up on the desk, do so or if you wish to take a step back for a bit, that's fine too but don't leave. There are too many of us who value you, your friendship and input.

One light indeed!