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Chatbots => Avatar Talk => Haptek => Topic started by: Freddy on June 17, 2007, 03:51:36 pm

Title: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on June 17, 2007, 03:51:36 pm
Edit :  I am no longer working on or supporting this program.  It pretty much does what it says on the tin and appears to work well for most people.  Feel free to download it still though, if you think it may be useful.



For a while now I have been working on a Haptek application and this is a tentative beta release, I'd be glad if folks would give it a whirl and see if it works on other systems.  All you need to do is unzip it and click on 'setup'.  There's also a help file zipped with it that should answer most questions.

The installer it uses is the inbuilt one for Visual Basic Express but I am still a little unfamiliar with it but I think it will work.  

For this program to work you need to install Micro$ofts .NET framework.  The link I provide here is to version 3.5 and should be fine for these purposes as it includes the old versions too:

Get .NET... (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=333325FD-AE52-4E35-B531-508D977D32A6&displaylang=en)


Here's a quick run down :

Hap Explorer was created to make it easier to fiddle around with Haptek models and make each of their settings simpler to navigate when trying to create things like hap-files and animations.  If you have tired of examining Figure Definition files for switches and parameters then you should find this tool useful.

If you have spent any time at all on Haptek then you may have found the simple command line interface of the player console a bit restrictive when it comes to messing around with the models and all their various settings.

With this program I have tried to put a front end on the Haptek Player for people who want easier access to a model's numerous settings and parameters etc.  I hope this tool will help speed up the whole process.

At the time of writing this is considered a semi beta release as it is hoped that I will get some feedback on what if anything needs to be added to this.  I have done a lot of testing but this still needs more, so unless you are happy to test this program without warranty, guarantees or all the rest of it then please do not use it.

Hap Explorer should run on Windows 2000 and XP -  basically with a set up that will run the Haptek Player without difficulty - if it runs on anything else then I would be happy to hear about it.  Many thanks.


Features



Reviews

"Heck, before Hap Explorer arrived we were all smoking dog hairs, now we know better!"
    - Red Neck Review

"I was lost without hope, all that changed when Hap Explorer came into my life, now I go out on Tuesdays!"
    - Bedroom Hacker Gazzete

"Duh, um like where is dah neked button, i know dere must be a neked button some place."
    - The Vocal Yocal

Note : If you download this piece of software, please return some feedback to help with development.  Without you there may not be any, and it's just nice to say thanks...

Latest Version :  v 0_8_0_20 ( I have left the previous working versions in case there are problems with this build.)  The latest version hopefully fixes bugs with European Operating Systems.

Log :

v0_8_0_10 - stable, seems to work in most cases, non-English issues.
v0_8_0_11 - added warning if notepad contains data, still issues with non-English installations (being worked on).
v0_8_0_20 - fixed bug for German OS, may possibly work in other European countries now.

Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on June 17, 2007, 03:56:32 pm
One thing to note is that the program needs to know the location of the hap_temp folder - and if it can't find it it will prompt you.  All is explained in the help document as to how to go about setting the hap_temp path.

Sorry 'bout that, I will try and get it to do an auto search if this presents a problem.


Here's a few screenshots too...

The first shows the general layout and is using the speech feature.
The second shows a little of how you can mess around with a model's material lighting.
The third shows how you can change the render settings and play with a model's parameters.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: wgb14 on June 19, 2007, 04:22:22 am
Fredy you tool is extremely useful, but may i suggest something? Why don't you try to add a timing query command + a stop and play button for every sound file that is loaded so to make sync with the animations easier? For example:

............load the sound file 2.ogg into your editor
........... use the play and stop commands to do things based on the current times
...........write the below script in the script file

\clock [t= 0.0] \load [file= [Intro\2.ogg]]
\clock [t= 13.600] \setmood [action=[sw=GestureMaster m=sleep]]
\clock [t= 13.600] \setSwitch [figure= fullBod switch= GestureMaster state= off ]
\clock [t= 13.600] \loadbackground [file= [BACK\entrance_2.jpg] ]

........save the final result

That way, we can create whole movies with our characters simply by using your tool! Let me know what you think! I defintely think is brilliant
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: wgb14 on June 19, 2007, 01:41:46 pm
Hi Freddy,

Installation was OK, no problems at all (it never asked me for the hap-temp folder, it found it automaticaly). As for .NET i already have it installed on my PC. The OS that  I am using is Windows XP Pro. As for the timing, what i am talking about is basically sync switches with the audio files. You can do that easily simply by using the appropriate query ("soundmgr currenttime soundfilename" and implement a simple pause and play button (\soundpause [file= [soundfilename] ] and \soundplay  [file= [soundfilename] ]). I think this will increase greatly the usefulness of your tool and it will be something that it would provide me great help to my work (I am a PhD student). Again many thanks for this excellent tool!

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 19, 2007, 01:56:32 pm
Ok, I think I see more clearly what you mean.   I'll have a play with it when I get some free time - again, thanks for your input, it is much appreciated.  :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: wgb14 on June 19, 2007, 02:42:41 pm
Just to be more speicifc:

I've loaded a file called 1.ogg using Browse and then query the player from the concol using soundmgr currenttime 1.ogg. It returned 77845. Now, using this value I  can issue a clock command and control any of the animations that are build in the character. That way I can create full screens with minimal efford. I think it is only matter of adding the appropriate buttons!
I can wait to see this in your tool! Again many thanks
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 19, 2007, 04:24:01 pm
I see...so you just want to be able get the /clock time at cetain points of the ogg file...if thats sufficient then I can easily incorporate that...working on it now...

Hmm I seem to have deleted my earlier post by mistake..oh well...here's a quote in case someone finds it useful or informative..

Quote
Hi wgb14, thanks for the positive comments!  Strangely enough my original idea for this program was as a animator and was going to be much as you have described.  I had got as far as generating timed events such as movement and position but found that not all commands can be timed using the \clock command, so I decided to omit the animation side for the time being.

For now I left it with people having the option of creating hapfiles with the hap pad that they could test live and then use elsewhere, perhaps along with the \clock command.

There's many ideas that could be added to this but it was convenient for me to draw a line for now and see how well it is received so far.  This first step is mainly to get the program to the point where it is useful, later I can add in more functionality like timed control of commands.

I'm interested to know how installation went and what version of Windows you are using.  Did the installer install .NET 2 for you as well?  As long as this build is pretty solid then I can take it further.  Also how did you get on with the hap_temp folder - did it find it ok or was it somewhere else?

Many thanks for your input



Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 20, 2007, 02:19:44 pm
I've done some work on this and I will post a new version later in the day which has some further audio controls, that will probably be around 8.00 pm UK time...i think thats roughly between 1.00/ 2.00 pm US time give or take...
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: wgb14 on June 20, 2007, 04:02:19 pm
Thanks Freddy can't wait to test it!
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 20, 2007, 07:05:09 pm
Here we go...this has extended audio functions for TTS and OGG, you can now:


I hope this is the kind of thing you wanted wgb, if not I am open for further enhancements :)

I had to limit the TTS time readout to whole seconds because for some reason the Visual Basic timers are not that accurate for timing tasks that involve updates which are less than 1 second.  I think with a bit of fiddling you will be able to sync things ok. 

****SEE TOP OF THREAD FOR LATEST VERSION****
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: wgb14 on June 20, 2007, 10:29:18 pm
Hi

The tool is now far more better than before. I just have two questions: a) When i initally load an ogg file it will not allow me to pause it unless i click stop first! b) Is there any way to set the size of the player in my own dimensions without dragging it? (e.g., I may want for example 1024x768)  Again many thanks for this great tool!
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 20, 2007, 10:43:24 pm
Hmm yes I noticed that strange glitch with the sound files too.  The only way I could get around it was to first select the viewer window before you do anything - this provokes the player into acknowledging an object - which in the first instance is the camera.  For some reason it works better that way, at the moment I am not sure if it is a Haptek problem or in some way related to my code.  I'll look into it again though, but try my suggestion.

On the player size I did originally allow the user to type in the dimensions of the player but I couldn't implement it well enough.  If you think that would be useful I will go back and take another look at it.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: wgb14 on June 21, 2007, 01:21:26 pm
Hi Freddy,

Yes your suggestion works ok, but if it is possible to fix it i would be greatful (it creates problems in the sync process). As for the size of the window, i think if you are about to do anything serious with the player you have to set its size propely first. At the moment it is impossible to set the correct dimensions just by dragging! Again many thanks for this great tool!
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 21, 2007, 01:35:38 pm
wgb,

I will see if I can get it to select the viewer window automatically.

On the player size - would being able to tap the dimensions into the size display boxes be enough?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: wgb14 on June 21, 2007, 02:04:54 pm
Sure, taping the dimensions in the boxes is OK! Again i think the tool is brilliant! Its something that i would expcet from Haptek to do. Many many thanks!
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 21, 2007, 06:49:12 pm
I've done the Player size control, but have yet to sort out that glitch with the pause button.  It looks like it is caused by the Haptek player.  For some reason if you load anything else into the player after you have already loaded an OGG, the stop Haptek /soundstop command does not work.  I'm trying to work around it and will keep you posted.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 21, 2007, 06:56:59 pm
Scrub that...it was me...I was forgetting to use the .ogg extension internally...should be fine now.
Attaching new version..

For the Player size you can now tap a new size into the  width and height boxes and press enter/return to alter it.  It still also works with the dragging resize.

One further note:  I added '+' buttons so you can note the present audio time to the notepad, this also has the effect of copying the time to your PC's clipboard, so after pressing the + button you can directly paste the time into any of the pads.  I thought this would be most useful when using the Hap Pad.

If there are any more requests or comments I would be pleased to hear them, thanks to wgb for your input , it was just the kind of thing I was hoping for  :)

****SEE TOP OF THREAD FOR LATEST VERSION****
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on June 22, 2007, 12:35:26 am
Freddy,
  Big Thanks, it'll be a few days before I have time to look at it but it sounds good.  I couldn't send the body female work to gamer or Duskrider so it's posted at your site, take a look at it if you have time.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on June 22, 2007, 12:41:23 pm
Freddy,
  I gave it a quick try, can't find the words.   probably have more to say after I use it more.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 22, 2007, 01:56:41 pm
No problem Carl, thanks for the body female.  I'm glad you decided to try out Hap Explorer, let me know how you get on.  :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on June 25, 2007, 12:51:14 pm
Freddy,
   I tried using it a little more yesterday, I'm using 0808 and should upgrade.  I found I have to be connected to the internet when using the program. I click setup to start it.   I've been using Body_Female.htr, which I load under My.  I've gone through most of the switches for body female.  I can't find anything for the waist which I looked for.  If I go to Parameters the screen you showed in help is not there, it remains the same as the switches.
  In Switches I was able to put in torso noise that gives the body enough movement to make her seem more realistic. I'm hoping to make a hap that will load this into Hal.  I didn't do much with Images. The materials should be useful when working with lighting.
  Surprised that we seem to have haps that cause bending at the waist but there are no switches for that, must be bending the legs. The Hap is bending the torso.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: wgb14 on June 25, 2007, 02:01:00 pm
Fredy many thanks, Now we can create full movies driven by one or multiple scripts using our favourite characters. I only wish that they would be some solution on the animation side (to create your own custom animations).  Again many  many thanks
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 25, 2007, 02:23:38 pm
Freddy,
   I found I have to be connected to the internet when using the program. I click setup to start it.   I've been using Body_Female.htr, which I load under My.  I've gone through most of the switches for body female.  I can't find anything for the waist which I looked for.  If I go to Parameters the screen you showed in help is not there, it remains the same as the switches.

Have you installed the .NET 2 framework?

You only need to click Setup to install the program, from then on it should appear in your start menu under 'Ai Dreams'.  Also you do not need to be connected to the internet.

Is anything appearing in the Parameters and Switches panels?  What do you mean by 'it remains the same as the switches' ?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on June 25, 2007, 10:39:24 pm
Freddy,
  I had net framework when using ATT, Since I've switched to verizon i've reformatted and reinstalled windows, haven't put in net framework. The Switches panel looks as it should, when I change to Prameters there is no change in the panel, it looks the same as the Switches panel.  I went by the pictures in the help.
  I'll add net frame work and try it then Upgrade .
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on June 26, 2007, 02:42:08 am
Freddy,
  I installed net framework 1 and 2 into the computer, I installed 0809 Hapexplorer. 
I have the program running on another computer, Installing net framework made it so it is not dependent on IE.  I just found the problem, I was using 800x600, Just changed the screen size and can find what is shown in the help files.  I should be all set for a while.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 26, 2007, 11:52:51 am
Good I am glad you worked it out.   I probably should have said it uses the higher res, but I assumed most people would be on that or higher these days.  Thanks for fillin gme in on the internet dependency - I can now advise users to install .NET 2 beforehand.  :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 26, 2007, 12:21:17 pm
Here's something I have found that can cause problems - having more than one instance of the hap_temp folder existing on your PC.  This is not specifically to do with Hap Explorer, but more to do with the general operation of the Haptek Player.  This problem means Hap Explorer may not be refering to the current instance of the folder. In turn this means switches, parameters and other things to do with the loaded model will not be displayed - because they are actually in some other hap_temp folder.

The reason for this is that the Haptek Player can sometimes switch to another filing position/path to create the hap_temp folder.  I have found it appearing both in the Haptek program directory and also in my Applications Data folder (in Documents and Settings but by default hidden.)  Occasionally also the hap_temp player does not delete itself as it should - this also seems to affect the chosen path and appears to lead the existence of more than one of these folders.

Here's what I do to rectify this sometimes:

Close down any programs using the Haptek Player eg, HapExplorer, Internet page, UltraHal.
Search for every instance of hap_temp - there will likely only be one or two of them, if any at all.*
Delete those folders and restart your application.
This forces a fresh instance of the hap_temp folder.
Locate the fresh hap_temp folder - the path to this folder is the one you want to use in Hap Explorer.

*Note: you will need to specify the search to include hidden files and folders.

This doesn't always happen if programs run ok, but sometimes it seems if an application crashes, the hap_temp folder doesn't get deleted as it should - this in turn means it gets chock full of old files.  So to summarise, the ideal situation is a hap_temp folder that deletes itself when the application closes and re-appears on the next occasion the program is used.  This is the correct way the hap_temp folder should be working.

Hopefully Hap Explorer is not crashing and causing this as I did a lot of work with error handling, but other programs or instances I can not be so sure of.

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on June 26, 2007, 08:25:57 pm
Freddy,
  Thanks for putting in the last post, I just created a hap to add body movement so you don't  have a head on a solid body, I found the switches using the hapexplorer and tried them in another player.  I've been looking for something to do this for quite a whie.  It should be fairly simple to load this hap at startup. 
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 30, 2007, 11:30:45 am
I was just wondering if any of the other members that downloaded the program have any comments ? I could do with some feedback on this...  Is it good, bad or useful etc etc?  It also helps me know if it is worth developing further.  Come on folks, please speak up...
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on June 30, 2007, 01:57:51 pm
Freddy,
  I think it's the best thing ever, I wish it had been developed earlier to help with what Haptek has not supplied.  As always happens with Hal people want different things for different purposes.
  As far as I can see everything works as it should, I've been working in Materials, to me it is lighting since I started working with some lighting Haps I created.  Question:  if I load a hap, in this case the original, all of the settings except go to zero, specuar poweris at 10.  The character is black, I can adjust the lighting to valuse I like and save it,  as a .mlf to load again later.  If I use it in the Hap registry it dosen't work which would be a problem for me. How can this be made useful to use with Hal?
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on June 30, 2007, 02:20:40 pm
Quote
all of the settings except go to zero, specuar poweris at 10.

Whats the missing word after 'except' ?

I'm not exactly sure what you mean by using something with Hal - do you mean using the .mlf file in Hal or something like that ?  What did you use in the Hap registry and what hap file are you refering to?

The .mlf files can only be used with Hap Explorer, but you can easily load them in and then use the '+' button on the materials panel to note them in Haptek hypertext format and then use them in a hap file.

Glad you like it and thanks for responding  :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: GT40 on July 01, 2007, 06:49:38 pm
Hi Freddy, sorry but I'm still using a prehistoric computer under W98SE!!!  :(  I downloaded from the MS site the specific Framework v2.0 for Windows 98. And then Hap Explorer. I can launch the program but when I want to use it, it stops.

I understand why you wrote "Hap Explorer should run on Windows 2000 and XP". When reading the manual, I can see it's a great and very useful software. A good reason for me to buy another PC!  :)

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 02, 2007, 04:38:52 pm
 :(  I'm sorry you can't use it, I had a feeling it wouldn't work in 98.  That was a good operating system in it's time, I was still using it last year but upgraded to 2000, then XP.  You can pick up both fairly cheaply nowerdays though.   If you want to upgrade then I suggest trying your local computer shop - they might have a cheap copy of 2000 or XP, that's how I have got mine in the past.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: GT40 on July 02, 2007, 05:33:15 pm

Thank you Freddy for your pieces of advice, but I really think I have to change my PC too! :)

It's an evidence that your Hap Explorer could be very useful to me, when I see what some others can do with Haptek characters. :(


Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 03, 2007, 01:33:33 pm
Well around 17-20 members have downloaded it, but so far I have only have feedback from two, so I am still in the dark over how useful it is.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 04, 2007, 01:16:48 pm
Freddy,
  I'm still playing with it,   "all of the settings except go to zero, specuar poweris at 10 "should be
" all of the settings except specuar power go to zero, specuar poweris at 10 ".  The objective I'm working towards is to get the character with lighting that will not provide white areas, would like some shadows and to be the correct coloration. 
  I hope you don't get discouraged and continue working on it,  I'm convinced the original lighting is to bright and the colors had to be dark which made her look like she walked through a coal mine.   
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 04, 2007, 01:27:01 pm
Yes, I agree the original lighting is too harsh and tends to bleach out the skin.  I have played with the lighting quite a lot and have found other settings to be more agreeable.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 04, 2007, 10:22:15 pm
Freddy,
   So far I learned you need the header so the haps created can work or there is a reliablilty factor.
After using the header the lighting hap I made was able to work in the HapRegistry, not the same lighting that was in the Hapexplorer but it did load and change. Naturaly I'm going to ask why the lighting is different in the Hapexplorer and the Hapregestry? 
  So far I can create a htr to load the figure, load a hap for the lighting , a hap to load torso noise for body movement and a hap to load a texture.    I'll have to try loading the lighting hap back into the Hapexplorer.
Carl2
 
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 05, 2007, 01:29:00 pm
Yes you usually need to define a hap as either a command or script file - try reading the section about the differences in the Haptek SDK.

Can you explain what you did in more detail, ie the steps you took.  Also it might be useful if you posted the hap file you used too.  What was different about the Hap Registry and Hap Explorer lights?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 05, 2007, 11:17:49 pm
Freddy,
  Command or script file, never worked with them as far as i know, I'll go to the SDK.
I'm going to try to recreate what I had done.  I opened the hapexplorer and loaded the standard Body_Female, she is shown in the viewer.  I go to the materials tab  which shows the lighting levels,
Ambient all are set to 1, diffuse all are set to 1, specular all set to .3 except the last which is 1, emissive all set to 0 except the last set to 1, specular power is set to 10.  If I look in the Body_femaleDef file I can find the lighting which is
DiffuseMaterialCoeff=  1.000000 1.000000 1.000000 1.000000
SpecularMaterialCoeff= 0.300000 0.300000 0.300000 1.000000
AmbientMaterialCoeff=  1.000000 1.000000 1.000000 1.000000
EmissiveMaterialCoeff= 0.000000 0.000000 0.000000 1.000000
SpecularPowerCoeff=    10.000000
Which agrees with what is stated in the Hap explorer and the lighting looks similar to other players.  Next I make some changes, specular power is changed to 15, Ambient  is set at .6, .6, .6 and 1.,
specular is set at .2, .2, .2 and 1.  So I now have
DiffuseMaterialCoeff=  1.000000 1.000000 1.000000 1.000000
SpecularMaterialCoeff= 0.200000 0.200000 0.200000 1.000000
AmbientMaterialCoeff=  0.6000000 0.6000000 0.6000000 1.000000
EmissiveMaterialCoeff= 0.000000 0.000000 0.000000 1.000000
SpecularPowerCoeff=    15.000000
    I can save this as a .mlf and load it at another time.  The  + will not work for me, haven't found how to use it.
    I'm fairly certian what I tried to do yesterday was load a lighting hap which I modified from the original lighting hap that comes with Body_female.htr.  If I go back to my I can load the lighting hap in scripts, I am using :
#HaptekSDK Version= 1.0  HapType= lighting FileType= text Name= standardLight

Light= Ambient
Type= AMBIENT
LightColor= 0.40 0.40 0.50
}

Light= LightOne
Type= DIRECTIONALLIGHT
#            R   G   B           
LightColor= 0.7 0.6 0.5
#                 x    y  z                 
LightDirection= -5.0 -3.5 8
}
This can load in the Hapexplorer but the lighting  is dimmer when compared to the Hapregistry player.

1, I'm lost when I use the + key
2, The Hapexplorer uses lighting parameters from the Def file which is different from hap lighting files
 
  I hope I have been able to explain the steps I took and the results obtained.
Carl2
 
   


Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 06, 2007, 05:36:51 pm
Thanks Carl for going into detail and yes it helps me a lot to understand what you are doing.

Firstly the '+' buttons in the program note the relevant details to the NotePad.  So if you click on the one in the materials panel it will note the current material settings to the NotePad. 

Secondly...

Yes there is a difference between the LIGHTS and the MATERIAL LIGHTING values... 

I tried your light hap here and the lights dimmed too.

Hmmm, generally a Haptek model will start up and use the "StandardLight.hap" which is three different types of LIGHT, which should be an Ambient and two directional lights.  The hap you mention only alters two set of lights.

I notice that your light hap reduces the power of LightOne and also changes it's direction.  Perhaps you have changed the direction too far to one side?  The value of z=8 may be too high as the original StandardLight.hap only has a setting of -2.0

By the way, I have never used the Hap Registry...how do you get into it?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 07, 2007, 12:16:13 am
***NEW VERSION***

I noticed the program wasn't accepting drag and drop files to the work surface.  This has now been rectified.  Please see the first post for the latest version.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 07, 2007, 10:35:48 pm
Freddy,
  I found the pad icon so that's working, also found the newest dfownload.  The lighting hap I use was the modified standard light, I have a few I made.  I'm interested in a lower light level, higher red on the right and higher blue on the left, also trying different skin colors, I confuse myself.
  The Hap registry is rather easy, clicking the registry brings up the control panel and the viewer, clicking the open console opens the console, I drag and drop mostly. I drag Body_Female.htr and the character loads. Other haps can also be loaded.  If you press refresh registry list Two lists are generated, One which I'll call the target and the larger list for what is to be controled with the slider.
  I'm pasting a hap for body movements which I've been looking for, give it a try and add or change as you like.

HaptekSDK Version= 1.0  HeaderLines= 2 HapType= command FileType= text
#Name= haptek_scene Icon= [ websters_icon ]
\SetSwitch [ Figure= body_female Switch= TorsoNoise State= e ]

Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 08, 2007, 02:13:55 pm
I finally found the Registry program you were talking about, it was in my SDK, it looks useful.

So did you have your lights set up wrong?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 09, 2007, 01:23:13 pm
Freddy,
  I checked out the lighting in the Hapregistry and the Hapexplorer,my lighting  is dim and appears the same in both.  Since I've found the notepad I made a lower lighting hap using Hap explorer that will work in the registry.  Still interested in redish light from the right and blueish light from the left.
  What would be useful is a direct link to ofen the help document you've included, since I'm just scratching the surface I'm sure there are other things you can include in the help. There is a Hapregistry included in the zip I made for GamerThom but you already found one.  Reading the Haptek SDK and getting an overload of info.
Carl2 
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 09, 2007, 01:35:53 pm
Ok Carl, keep at it and good luck with your experiments..
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 11, 2007, 02:04:43 am
Freddy,
  Just to keep you informed, I'm still working with body_female, Just tried loading her with torso noise into the Hal program, she loads but the noise is not present which I swore I had working,  I went back to the Hap explorer and loaded my modified htr
#HaptekSDK Version= 1.0  HeaderLines= 2 HapType= command FileType= text
#Name= haptek_scene Icon= [ websters_icon ]

\load   [file= data\body_female\body_femaleDef.hap]
\load [file= [D:\Hal X\SavedThis\FBC\Body_F\body_femaleStartup.hap]]
#\load [file= [D:\Hal X\SavedThis\FBC\Body_F\LoadSn.hap]]
\load   [file= data\body_female\TorsoNoise4.hap]

This loads the character with the torso noise,  I'm pretty sure loading the original uncompressed htr takes to long for the files to uncompress so the Torsonoise hap will not work.  Another interesting  side effect is since I'm using uncompressed files the files do not appear in the Hap_temp directory,
and in the explorer. 
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 11, 2007, 01:39:12 pm
The Player uncompresses htr files into the hap_temp folder.  The only files that end up in hap_temp are those that are uncompressed from an htr/haptar file.  Dropping other files or loading them into the player does not make them appear in hap_temp.

HapExplorer scans the hap_temp folder to see what files have been packaged with the models (these appear in the 'built in' drop down lists), so unless there is something in there it won't show anything.

I hope that helps.

I think you are probably right about the files taking too long to load.  Those load commands will be executed as soon as the player can do them and with no preferences.  In that process it may mean your noise commands are not getting done after the model fully loads.  One thing I can suggest off the top of my head is to use the \clock command to time the loads, but I don't think that's a perfect solution.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 11, 2007, 06:56:46 pm
Freddy,
  I read something about the problem I'm having in the Haptek SDK and thay did offer a solution, if I can get it to work.  Right now I'm in an in between state, I have the uncompressed files I can modify and load but I'm still working on them. At the same time I'm working on lighting and skins. I'm hoping to choose the setting I think are right and change the files to load the corrected settings that I like.  It would be nice if the  compressor worked backwards and could make the files into a htr.
  Really didn't mean to take you off your work and thanks for the help.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 11, 2007, 07:39:29 pm
Yes it would be nice if the compression worked backwards, but alas we have to buy HapTargh for that...

Good luck again and you weren't taking me away from my work, I was happy to try and help :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: turtlekid on September 09, 2007, 03:58:44 pm
Freddy I have been working with Explorer foe about 4 or 5 weeks (old and hard headed) I like it real well. Useing it to find out  ways to move. Thanks and kept up the good work Thanks
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on September 10, 2007, 03:57:03 pm
Thanks TurtleKid, it makes all the difference to hear that people find it useful.  Thanks for letting me know and I am glad you like it  :).
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on September 14, 2007, 09:06:36 pm
While I am down here muddying the waters...if any of the other members who have downloaded the program would be so kind as to tell me if they found it useful then it would make me very happy indeed  :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Chischis on October 18, 2007, 10:40:08 pm
Bumping this because I've just registered and discovered this software.

I just want to take a full body model, change the skin, then save it as an HTR file to use in Ultra Hal.  How do I do this?  I can change the skin in Hap Explorer, but can't work out how to save the file back.  I would appreciate any help you guys can give.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on October 20, 2007, 02:55:01 pm
To make new HTR files you will need to buy some software from Haptek.  My program only allows you to 'explore' HTR files and play around with skins, settings and things like that - there is no way of creating new ones.  I'm guessing you know about dragging and dropping skins onto a character...  You could also use HAP files (called from within the HAL brain file) to load the appropriate skin once your fullbody has loaded, obviously that is going to take a little work on coding.  But if you want an all-in-one HTR file then it means spending some money at Haptek.

Hope that helps.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Chischis on October 20, 2007, 09:58:32 pm
To make new HTR files you will need to buy some software from Haptek.  My program only allows you to 'explore' HTR files and play around with skins, settings and things like that - there is no way of creating new ones.  I'm guessing you know about dragging and dropping skins onto a character...  You could also use HAP files (called from within the HAL brain file) to load the appropriate skin once your fullbody has loaded, obviously that is going to take a little work on coding.  But if you want an all-in-one HTR file then it means spending some money at Haptek.

Hope that helps.

Thanks Freddy, I guess I can live without having a recompiled HTR file if there's another method, but I've only had Hal for a few days now, so I'm not sure how to achieve loading a new skin inside Ultra Hal (I've got the full-body HTR of course, and loaded that as a character, but I'd definitely like to change her appearance if I can, hair as well).  Any chance you could point me in the right direction?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on October 21, 2007, 03:19:22 pm
I'm not that familiar with Hal 6.x, I used to play with Hal 5 but I never moved up.  Basically Hal consists of a main program and also a body of VBScript that passes as the 'brains'.  Within that scripting (which you can alter yourself) you can do a lot of tricks.  Your best starting point would probably be to familiarise yourself with the Brain Editor.

On coding a start-up skin...I think a good bet is to ask over on the Zabaware forums, someone there is sure to know how to get it working in Hal 6.  There may already be a plugin you can use too, so I'd search that forum as well.

Sorry I couldn't be more help but I'd rather point you in a good direction than guess on the coding, but it is probably best that you get used to programming Hal before I go any further anyway.  You may find some of the tutorials in the Haptek section here useful at some point.  Also, if you get more involved I recommend downloading the Haptek SDK or the unofficial guide that can also be found in our Haptek tutorial section.

Whatever you do, good luck with it  :)

P.S. There are plenty of characters, skins, heads and accessories about so you will be able to get a character you like.  Also, things like wigs can be skinned too so there are a lot of options.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Chischis on October 22, 2007, 01:03:02 am
Thanks Freddy.  I guess I'll just have to look for some tutorials.  So far, I'm not getting on with the Brain Editor at all.  Seems rather counter-intuitive at times, clunky, and desperately needs a "doesn't look like it came from a Windows 3.1 app"-makeover.  Verbot's editor is much easier, but it's harder to get Verbot to talk to you at random.  At least Hal has a brain that does this.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on October 24, 2007, 10:16:46 pm
 Chischis
    Just read the last few posts, there is a plugin form Virtual humans that allows you to load fullbody with a different skin, and also has more features for fullbody characters.  I had a problem with the loading of the different skin for the character and found other people had a similar problem.  My solution was to use the uncompressed hap files in the Htr which can be changed without being corrupted.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on October 25, 2007, 09:22:32 pm
Is it the plugin on this page Carl ?

http://www.vrconsulting.it/halplugins/vr_hal00.html

It looks like the one to me....here's the help page associated with it too :

http://www.vrconsulting.it/halhelp/vrHaptekHelp.html
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: GT40 on July 06, 2008, 05:46:40 pm

Hi Freddy! As I wrote you on Zabaware, now I finally have a PC with XP and I installed your Hap Explorer. But unable to run it: the interface appears, with always the same error message:

"Unhandled exception has occured in your application.
...........
Conversion from "1.000" to type 'Double' is not valid."

After putting that last sentence in Google, I got a reply in Spanish. But not very useful.  ;D

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 07, 2008, 02:29:23 pm
Hmmm, not come across that one before.  Did you install the .NET framework ?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: GT40 on July 07, 2008, 07:38:31 pm

Yes Freddy, Framework v2.0. And I tried other versions (2.0 too) found elsewhere on the web.

Maybe not a good idea, but always the same message. :(


Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 08, 2008, 10:19:46 pm
I'll try and see what I can do then.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: GT40 on July 08, 2008, 11:12:13 pm

Don't worry Freddy. Little loss of interest for new Haptek stuffs for now. Or maybe a putty head from time to time.  ;D


Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 09, 2008, 11:25:04 am
Ok then, I will leave it alone.  I've lost interest in Haptek myself too, but I will try and figure it out at some point.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 23, 2008, 11:51:44 pm
Freddy,
   Just updated my  computer to a HP quad with vista,  before putting in Ultra Hal I want to put in some other software.   I did download the Haptek player but it works very poorly with vista.   Zabaware upgraded hal for vista and I am wondering if the Haptek player is also upgraded.  Any input on this? 
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Art on July 24, 2008, 12:07:22 am
Carl2,

If I may interject...I too switched to Vista Premium last year. In spite of the much touted graphical bells and whistles, I was
saddly disappointed by the fact that a lot of graphic oriented programs performed poorly or mediocre at best, including Haptek
and Hal.

Some of the MS programs like Office kept asking me for my email password every time I logged on and would never accept
it in it's file.

Several other programs that I rely on on a daily basis led me to remove Vista and return to XP, which worked fine.

To each their own, but if it ain't broke, don't fix it!! ;)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on July 24, 2008, 01:00:01 pm
Yes, like I said elsewhere, VIsta is resource-hungry and will slow down a lot of programs, unless you are lucky like Carl and have a quad-core that is.

As far as the Haptek player goes I haven't kept up with any upgrades, but I think it must be something they will have to look at if they haven't already.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on July 24, 2008, 06:55:05 pm
  Both oif you thanks for the input.  I  also liked Vista because of the security which now seems to bea problem at the Haptek site, the character never appears and everything is very slow.  Actualy the speed of the P4 with XP is quick enough for everything Dragon and Hal could use a little improvement. 
  I'll mention I just downloaded the Bzip2 for windows from source fourge, you could modify the uncompressed htr and put them back into an htr.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: NEIL on August 07, 2008, 01:58:59 pm
Hi Freddy, The explorer is a great program.
I probably don't use it as much as i should.
I select certain movements & add them to notepad, but when i close the program
I remember that i did not save the moves & have to go back & start again.
Is there a quick fix to put in a  " do you want to save? "
Before closing???
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on August 07, 2008, 08:05:29 pm
Carl are you saying that HTR's are just Bzip files ?

Neil, you caught me in a helpful mood as I had abandonded this project for the most part in favour of other things now.  But I went back and hacked a new version that prompts you if there is something in the NotePad (that one only, other pads are not supported).
Now it should let you save your work if you close it by mistake.

I left the older version there incase there was a problem with the new version, so let me know if it works alright for you okay?  I'm running .NET 3 or something now, but I think it should work with .NET 2 as before.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: NEIL on August 08, 2008, 08:02:11 am
 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Wow! That was quick, thanks Freddy.
Works fine, now i won't have to swear etc.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on August 08, 2008, 02:07:02 pm
You're welcome Neil, happy to help and to stop the swearing lol :)

Sorry, forgot to mention this new version is available from the first post in this topic but if you found it I guess other people will...
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: billmele on October 21, 2008, 12:35:06 am
When I attempt to download this Beta Version I receive the following error messages when trying to extract the files. I have version 0_8_9_10 and it runs OK.


!   C:\My Downloads\HapExplorer_0_8_0_11.zip: Unexpected end of archive
!   C:\My Downloads\HapExplorer_0_8_0_11.zip: The archive is either in unknown format or damaged
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Maviarab on October 21, 2008, 09:16:50 am
Welcome along Bill, sounds like the file has been corrupted during downloading (happens every now and then unfortunately).

Try re downloading and let us know if problem persists :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Jake on February 10, 2009, 08:02:55 am
When I run the setup.exe, I get the following message box...

System Update Required
Unable to install or run the application.  The application requires that assembly WindowsBase Version 3.0.0.0 be installed in the Global Assembly Cache (GAC) first.
More information on this system update can be found by visiting the site here.
[OK]

clicking the "here" takes me to the entrance page of this site... but I did not see anything about this error message there?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Maviarab on February 10, 2009, 09:48:38 am
Hi James,

this is Freddys little baby so afraid I can't help you directly.

He will be along ina  few hours most likely if you can hang on in there, but be appreciated if can let us know what versiob windows you on (or linux or whatever) with what service pack etc in order for Freddy to better remedy it for you :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 10, 2009, 10:35:20 am
Thanks Mav.  This is a new one on me, at this stage I am just guessing that you may not have installed the .NET framework ?  Did you install the .NET framework mentioned at the beginning of the thread ?

I updated the program a few months back and was using .NET 3 at the time, it's possible I used features only available in that version.  Hard to know these things as most people just download the program and never say a word - this makes it hard to develop.  Anyway's let me know how you get on.

Here's where the .NET 3.5 is located :

http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=333325FD-AE52-4E35-B531-508D977D32A6&displaylang=en

Let me know how you get on.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Jake on February 11, 2009, 05:26:11 am
Thanks Freddy!  NICE program!!  I'm apparently having a few problems on this computer right now... I did install the .NET 3.5, but when I had Windows update apply the SP, it got an error on the install, twice!  But that did not stop your program from installing... GREAT program!!!!  I think someone else said it earlier... THIS is the kind of stuff that I would have expected Haptek to supply, but of course, they don't.  Again... GREAT work, nice program... it's going to be a great help... it's added at least another 20 switches that I did not know about and has added a lot of missing information on the ones that I was already using. ;D

On another topic...  I'm considering getting back into programming, (I gave it up because I was seeing too many sunrises)... what language do you use and why do you like it?  I want something where my work can eventually become an EXE file.  I have lots of experience at the principles of programming, I've done lots of web pages, ASP, VBScript, javascript, etc.  Back when I was more in to it... (MANY years ago), I used some assembly language, pascal, C, basic, etc.  I wouldn't mind finding something that could produce an EXE, but has a little more forgiving nature than a language like assembly or C.  Any recommendations?

Thanks,
Jake
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 11, 2009, 04:27:54 pm
Thanks for the compliments Jake  :)  At the time I wrote it I was getting fed up with scanning through figure definition files to find all the switches, so I decided to write something that made it all a lot easier.  I'm glad people have found it useful.

Just for the record was it the .NET 3.5 that made it work ?  If so I will add that to the top of the thread so other people can find it easily.

As for programming languages, Hap Explorer was written using Visual Basic Express.  You can find it here :

http://www.microsoft.com/express/vb/

I have used Visual Basic 6 in the past, but I decided to migrate all the code for this program over to Express.  As a programming language it can be quite complex, but I found if you stick with it you can do a lot of neat things.   The other bonus of course is that it is FREE!  It's nice to see Microsoft do something like that.  I did some programming in C when I was at Uni, but now I find this MS Basic adequate for my programming needs, especially since it will run so fast these days, when years ago Basic was always considered slow.  It's great for the hobbyist programmer and I find it is pretty forgiving - debugging is well handled I think.

The only gripe over VB6 that used to make standalone EXE's is that these days people have to install some version of .NET too for it to work properly.  I haven't figured how to make this task automatic yet, but apparently it can be done.  But you do see more and more programs that need .NET to run, so it is catching on.

So yes, I would recommend VB Express, I hope that helps!
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Jake on February 12, 2009, 04:43:17 am
Yep!  .NET 3.5 did it.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 12, 2009, 03:49:00 pm
Thanks - I've updated the top of the thread.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on February 17, 2009, 12:18:22 am
Freddy,
  Just downloaded Net Framework 3.0 and the Hap Explorer.  Body_female is in Xp in this computer and appears to work okay, saw some of the problems others had with Haptek and vista.  I've been using the Hap registry for ages, think it's great.  With your knowledge you could probably have the characters standing on there heads.
Carl2

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 17, 2009, 12:11:23 pm
 :D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on February 18, 2009, 09:31:28 pm
  Not instatlling with net 3.0, going to try net 3.5.
Freddy you should have said something.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Maviarab on February 18, 2009, 10:26:36 pm
4 to 5 posts up Carl :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on February 18, 2009, 11:45:40 pm
    Works well with 3.5 net framework, even noticed the Slidebar in what looked like the Hap Explorer.  I can rember playing with the lighting quite awhile ago.  There a few things I'd like to get back to working on and the Hap explorer has sparked my interests.
Hal 6.2 seems to be working well in XP,  but still becomes unresponsive in Vista.  I'll play around for a while before asking questions.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 19, 2009, 02:28:25 pm
Yeah I did say it needs 3.5 at the beginning of the thread, we also mentioned it a few posts up - this was only discussed recently so you probably missed it.  Pay attention !  ;D  Only joking...
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on February 21, 2009, 02:15:31 pm
  I had a chance to get more familiar with it last night, bigest problem was the taskbar hid the slider control.  I just used one of the lighting commands to change the lighting in a startup htr, couldn't believe how bight a shirt became when loaded into Hal vs the original jpg. 
  I've downloaded the vr Haptek plugin that I have to install and try out.  Planning on changing the lighting according to the time of day along with her colthing.  While talking about lighting I noticed I noticed the lighting setup is deffrent from what is mentioned in the Haptek SDK, the SDK incoperates ambient, floodlights with color, positioning and distances.
  I did read through the post and did see the 3.5, but decided to use something with a little use to give it time to get bugs out but it dose need 3.5, my own fault.  Anyways great job and I wish more people would use it, we'd be able to move forward a lot faster.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 21, 2009, 02:26:32 pm
Hmm task bar hiding the slider ?  I guess that's the one at the bottom - my best advice on that one is to use a higher resolution for your desktop.

It did used to work with just .NET 2, but I made a few modifications that meant it now needs 3.5

As for the lights, yes there are two things to know about - one is 'materials' and the other is 'lights'.  Hap Explorer only changes the material properties, there is no provision for controlling lights.  Most models come with lights already set up.  It's not possible to add lights to a scene once the scene is loaded - the lights need to be set up in a different file which is accessed when the scene/model is loaded.

I had thought about giving control over the more general lights but never got around to it.  One of the reasons was it isn't possible to determine what lights are actually in the scene.  This is a Haptek limitation.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on February 22, 2009, 01:14:50 pm
   Pretty sure you'r incorrect about the lighting, I agree that the characters have there own lighting haps.  There are lighting haps that I'm fairly certian came from Haptek, Light from above, light from below, from right and left that can be put in that will change the lighting.  I read the SDK and made a few myself that will work.  Your's  are much easier to use aand you can see the changes you make before putting it inop a hap form.  The floodlights would be a special purpose thing.
  I noticed net framework 2 in the older computer where I have loads of files for Hal, waiting for the USB memory stick to show up so I can move them into this computer.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 22, 2009, 01:21:22 pm
Believe as you wish Carl, but I have done a lot of work on lighting and I can assure you that Hap Explorer only adjust's the material's properties - like their reflective, ambient and diffuse qualities.  In short, these properties deal with the way light is effected when it falls on the object.

Lights as used in the lighting Hap files are another kettle of fish, they are for controlling actual lights in the scene, like Spot and Directional - Hap Explorer has no way of changing these - unless you load a Hap file or something like that.

Material settings only have a local effect, ie the model in question, Lights on the other hand have a global effect.  Try putting two objects in one scene and altering the material qualities of each one and you will see what I mean.

A lighting Hap will work only if there are lights already in the scene, which in most cases is true.  Most Haptek models come with the default lighting of around 3 different lights.  That's why those light haps you mention work as they target the lights already in the scene.

When you change the material properties it changes the way light gets effected by the material in question; this is what you are doing with Hap Explorer when you use the sliders.  I hope that explains things a little better, but if in doubt, most of the information is in the Haptek SDK.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on February 22, 2009, 11:13:51 pm
Freddy,
  I believe we are not understanding each other,  1, I agree the hrt wucompresses and loads a female body.hap.  2, I can, just did, drag a Light hap file in to change the lighting and I think this disagrees with  your statement of " It's not possible to add lights to a scene once the scene is loaded ".   3,  that Hap Explorer only adjust's the material's properties - like their reflective, ambient and diffuse qualities.
I'd add it controls ambient light and the Specullar Power of some lighting.  4, " That's why those light haps you mention work as they target the lights already in the scene." you seem to disagree with the statement in 2,.
  Here is the text from fullobodylight.hap 
Light=Ambient
LightColor=0.4 0.4 0.5

Light=LightOne
Type=DirectionalLight
LightColor= 1.0  0.8 0.8
LightDirection= .4 -0.5 2
  So we have the Ambient light and a directional light which must be Specular Power.  Reading your post over a few dozen times it's easier to see what your explaining.
I really like the Hapexplorer,  already used it to add body noise which I probably never would have been able to do,  quickly and easily been able to adjust the lighting so the character is not too bright.
  Frist I'll admit that the lighting is a little over my head and thanks for explaining it for me.  Second I've used it, like it and want to say thanks for putting in all the work.
  Working on vr's  vrHaptek plugin,  I installed it but the brain files weren't put in, triedusing Hal anyways and got those blank responses. 
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 23, 2009, 02:12:09 pm
Lol, well it's not an easy subject - here's my response.  I am using CAPITALS just to emphasise what the differences are, I am not shouting at you!

You said : "2, I can, just did, drag a Light hap file in to change the lighting and I think this disagrees with  your statement of " It's not possible to add lights to a scene once the scene is loaded ".

My reply : Like I said, it is NOT possible to ADD lights to a Haptek scene after that scene has loaded.  All you are able to do is control the lights ALREADY in the scene and that's why the light haps work - because most models have a default set of lights which get loaded at run-time.  The light haps are changing the properties of the lights ALREADY in the scene.

You said: "3,  that Hap Explorer only adjust's the material's properties - like their reflective, ambient and diffuse qualities.
I'd add it controls ambient light and the Specullar Power of some lighting."


My reply : Hap Explorer does NOT control any LIGHTS, all it controls is the MATERIAL PROPERTIES (the exception is; you can adjust the light settings if you load a light-effecting Hap file to target the PRE-EXISTING lights).  Hap Explorer can alter the Ambient and Specular Power of the MATERIALS but this is not the LIGHTS.

You said: "4, " That's why those light haps you mention work as they target the lights already in the scene." you seem to disagree with the statement in 2,"

My reply : It does not really disagree with 2, because I later said that it IS POSSIBLE to control lights ALREADY in the scene.

Key points :

MATERIALS = the surface of the models and the way they react to light.  Controllable by Hap Explorer with the sliders.
LIGHTS =  actual light sources in the scene.  Not controllable by Hap Explorer directly APART from being able to load light-effecting Hap files.  YES they can be ADJUSTED with a Hap file, but new or extra light sources cannot be added after the scene has fully loaded.  To add more lights you need to do external work on your lighting file.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Then you went on to the fullbodylight.hap...

You said : "So we have the Ambient light and a directional light which must be Specular Power."

My reply : Not really sure what you mean there, the directional light is not Specular power, directional light is as it's name suggests...a light-source shining in a certain direction.  My best understanding of Specular power is that it is a material's shininess or gloss.

That's about the limit of my understanding, I hope it makes some sense.  I'm still learning here too and am only reporting back what I have found to be true with Haptek.  I might be slightly off on my definitions, but from what I have learnt from working on Explorer and things this is the way it seems to work.

--------------------------------------------------------------


There's a good page at Haptek which says pretty much the same as what I have posted here.  Here's a quick quote from it :

"Lights are initialized in a lighting file, which is loaded by the scene file as described above. An example lighting file is "StandardLight.hap", installed with the player. A lighting file is the only place to create a light. They cannot be added to the scene during runtime. Once a light exists in the scene, its properties such as Color, Type, Position, and Direction may be modified with the \SetLight command. At this time, only Point, Directional, and Ambient lights are supported. Spot lights and Slide Projector lights may be added in the future."

You can find that page here :

http://www.haptek.com/developers/HaptekGuide4/MakinContent/scene/


In the end we will get there !  Finally, thanks for saying 'thanks', I'm glad you have found the program useful.  ;D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Maviarab on February 23, 2009, 02:34:46 pm
hehe...y'all lost me at the lights  ::) ;D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 23, 2009, 02:44:36 pm
Damn it's hard to explain things sometimes  :D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: GT40 on February 23, 2009, 04:42:41 pm

Hi everyone. Just a little thought about lights and lightings. I'm not a specialist at all, but made a special light for my dear Meghan (the torso Lola from Haptek Corporate). Just a file I found, don't remember where, and altered.

http://gt40.chez-alice.fr/Haptek/Lighting.hap

With my adjustments, she gets lovely blue eyes (people who speak to her confirm!). I must say her teeth and tongue turn a little bit blue, too, but nobody complained.

I just want to say that, if I use this file (in the Haptek player or in a web page), then I can use any light_from-what-you-want.hap (and change it): the Lighting.hap (and its special blue light) is still active. Both lights are "mixed".

This was my (very useful, as always) participation.  ;D

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 23, 2009, 04:58:35 pm
Thanks GT40 that's a useful and timely example of a 'Lighting File' hap.  8)

Which will, according to Haptek, get loaded at run-time and hence you will get two lights set up in your scene !

Which then you can freely change.

Yay!
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on February 23, 2009, 11:09:26 pm
Freddy,
   After reading your frist post a few times my initial response was to take it line by line, towards the end I noticed I was doing this which I now regret.  Both your posts were meant to inform me and I'll say thanks.  While using the Hapexplorer I kept thinking I'll have to find out about this and that.  After reading your last post I opened the Haptek SDK. 
  I didn't find the pages I was looking for yet but will get back when I do.
  Seems interesting to me, while trying to get the material  on the character to look like the color in the jpg I had to change the material setting in the Hapexplorer which I did not want to do.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 24, 2009, 01:03:46 pm
No problem Carl, I can assure you it was just as hard to explain it as it probably was to understand my ramblings!

I think the main thing is really to understand the difference between lights and materials.  It took me while to get to grips with and most of it was learnt when I was making Hap Explorer.  The SDK was some help in understanding things, but it's not as clear as crystal until you start to play around with it all.

Anyways, I was happy to try and explain - I hope it will make more sense to you at some point.  I am sure there are things I have missed and that there are still things to learn.  As always, good luck with your experiments  :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Maviarab on February 24, 2009, 05:17:06 pm
Ummm.....lights  ??? hehe  ::) ;D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Duskrider on February 24, 2009, 08:54:55 pm

I downloaded the hap explorer and the 3.5 net.
Hap explorer installed but said I need to install haptek player.
I have haptek player installed.
How can I tell it I have haptek player stalled or whatever I need to tell it.
Can you tell me without sending me to help files ?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 24, 2009, 09:43:23 pm
There's not much in the way of help files to point you to.  Only the basic user guide.

But, the way it looks for the Haptek player is to look in the registry I think - it's been more than a year and a half since I worked on this and I had stopped working on it, so I forget the exact details at the moment.

Do you use a registry cleaner that might have removed the entry for the Haptek Player ?

My best suggestion at this point is to say to you to reinstall the Haptek player and try again.

Lemme know how you get on.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Duskrider on February 27, 2009, 02:04:09 am

Hap Explorer never would work on my desktop computer.
But then lot of programs won't work there.
It did work on my old laptop. 
Laptop died in December.
New laptop is bought and will install hap explorer but it refuses to recognize my haptek player. 
I have installed and deleted haptek three times.  No good.
I installed and deleted hap explorer 3 times.
They refuse to meet even acknowledge each other exist. 
I drop Sandee on open Hap Explorer 3 times.  Now Sandee's mad.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Jake on February 27, 2009, 07:03:58 am
Freddy...

I sent you a private message, but I'm not sure it went through... let me know if you did not get it and I'll try it again.

Thanks,
Jake
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 27, 2009, 02:12:43 pm
Hi Jake,

I got your message fine, it did go through the first time but never mind.

I can help you with that, but I need a little while to check over my code, it's been ages since I did this and my memory of it is fuzzy.  I also need to re-install VB Express as I built a new PC a short while ago and I didn't put it on here yet.  Leave it with me and I will get back to you.
 
:)

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 27, 2009, 03:13:26 pm
Dusky,

What version of Windows are you using ?  I have doubts this will work on Vista - maybe you could try running it as Administrator, I understand Vista hides stuff away.  MicroSoft seems to think we can't be trusted with our own machines these days.

Maviarab might be able to help you with running things on Vista - personally I have no plans to use it, not until I really have to, hopefully that day will not come.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Maviarab on February 27, 2009, 03:15:20 pm
Want me to start beta vista testing it for you dude?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on February 27, 2009, 03:41:51 pm
Sure, maybe you can work out the Vista problems for us  ;D  Cheers.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Maviarab on February 27, 2009, 04:09:08 pm
Test 01:

Installed Hap player....clicked 'show me'....went to web page....didnt have a player istalled to show content...hmmmmm

Re sinatlled from web site....same thing. Cancelled it....installed activex script....hap player showed.

So, double clicked Setup.exe for the hapexplorer....initialised...opened up ok....dragged fullbod onto explorer (wouldnt drag onto hap window)...and all seems fine.

So, system, Vista32 Ultimate, UAC is disabled, I am the admin (no other accounts except mine), .net3.5 was already installed anyway...

Only thing I can possibly think for anyone having issues...are you using version 0.8.0.10 OR 0.8.0.11?

I downloaded v0.8.0.11 and it ran perfectly fine on this machine.

If anyone still having any issues, let me know in this thread and ill try and recreate them on my Vista machine.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on February 27, 2009, 09:21:46 pm
Duskrider,
  I ran into a problem with the Hapexplorer installing, possibly the same issue. The Hapexplorer is looking for the Haptek temp file
hap_temp.  Try running a player that opens in the Hap Player, I double click on a htr.  this should give you a hap_temp folder where everything is uncompressed.  I made the folder read only so it did not disappear and loaded the Hapexplorer.  I'm using XP but it sounds like the same problem.  My hap_temp disappears almost instantly after shutting down the Hap Player, much faster than in the past.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on March 01, 2009, 03:03:56 pm
Carl, does Hap Explorer not work if you don't do this ?  It should open a Haptek window, then check for the hap_temp folder...

Dusk, please can you clarify the error -  is it saying it can't find the hap_temp folder ?  Also, does a Haptek window appear ?



Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on March 01, 2009, 07:00:48 pm
Freddy,
  Been awhile ago and I was unfamiliar with it, used earlier versions some time ago.   To the best of my memory it began to load, no viewer ? , I believe it tried to find the hap_temp and sent a notice saying it could not find it. The Hapexplorer would not work.
  I remember looking for it, starting  a character,  noticed it disappeared right after exiting the Hap Player so I changed the properities of the folder to read only.  Changed it back to RW after Hap explorer was up and running and it is okay.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on March 01, 2009, 07:03:49 pm
Ah right, so long as you can get it working.  You can also set the hap_temp path within the directory options of Hap Explorer..
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on March 02, 2009, 09:50:50 pm
  It's been up and running without problems for a while.  Also been playing with the Bzip2 that Haptek uses for compression, I have 3 versions, one runs in the command prompt, one works with txt files, and another, Haptek must have made their own version.    While using the switches in the Hapexplorer I found some switches not working,  I've found I can open the Htr, but can not make changes without corrupting the file.  Opening the file should bring me to the paramaters used with the Haptek engine.  It would be nice to tweak the settings similar to the way you can tweak the smile hap.  I did learn when Body_female .htr is opened in the Hap registry it loads a body_female 3,300kb file that is a Haptek Player doc, the original htr is about 1,000kb.  The body_female 3,5000 kb will load in the hap registry but not in the Hapexplorer.  When it loads the other files: startup, hair, skin ect appear.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on March 23, 2009, 08:23:29 pm
Freddy. 
  As you know I'm interested in the lighting.  I started making a new texture to load onto fullbody.  In the past I used the Haptek SDK methods to change lighting.  Seems much easier to use the Hap explorer to set the lighting.  A while ago I played with the Hap explorer and got this out as a result:   \setmaterial [ figure= body_female i0= 1 r= 0.652174 g= 0.652174 b= 0.652174 a= 1]  which I used in a htr i made to load body_female.  While using the the Hap explorer again I get  a lighting.milf file which contains :
 
#CGANIMATOR~MATERIAL LIGHTING FILE#
0.652
0.652
0.652
1
0.757
0.757
0.757
0.757
0.2
0.2
0.2
0
0
0
0
1
38.3

That  seems  to be then settings in the Hap explorer.  When the file is put into Haptek She reads the numbers.  How can I convert the above info into a lighting text to be used with Ultra Hal?  At present I'm using the Hapexplorer window to set the texture I'm making.  Also I've been unable to find the lighting file for Body_female that fullbodygirl has.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on March 23, 2009, 09:31:17 pm
Hi Carl,

Yes, I did mention in the help files that the .mlf files are just for use by Hap Explorer.  You can't use them directly with Haptek, it's just a way of making them easily restored in Hap Explorer for later use.

If you want to use material settings for Haptek there is a simple method :

1) Make any changes to the material as you see fit.

2) Go to the bottom of the Materials section and in the bottom right hand corner is a '+' button (see image).

3) Click on the + button !

4) Open up the 'Pads' and in the Notepad the current material settings will have been saved there for use in Haptek.

Hope that helps :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on March 24, 2009, 12:25:48 pm
Freddy,
  Again thanks for the quick reply, again I should have checked the help. Your advice makes it much easier to work with the Hap explorer.  It seems the lighting may be additive as is the case with some of the motion haps.  I've been able to find a lighting that isn't to bright and and dosen't change the color when moved from Paint Shop to the haptek player.  I have a collection of lighting files I've moved into this computer, some work without problems and some are not as reliable. 
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on March 24, 2009, 12:59:19 pm
No problem Carl. Good luck with what you are doing..
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on March 24, 2009, 09:06:13 pm
Freddy,
  I've been playing with the lighting haps and I remember discussing this with you.  The original htr is set with two lights and I remember he added a as of this writing.   Natruraly I had to try to add another.  I just got it working.  I have the ambient, directional 1 and directional 2.  I'm using a low ambient, red from one side and blue from the other side.  nothing great but it may present other possibilties.  The script is:

#HaptekSDK Version= 1.0  HapType= lighting FileType= text Name= standardLight

Light= Ambient
Type= AMBIENT
LightColor= 0.50 0.50 0.50
}


Light= LightOne
Type= DIRECTIONALLIGHT
LightColor= 0.0 0.0 0.4
LightDirection= 4.4  -4.5 -4
}

Light= LightTwo
Type= DIRECTIONALLIGHT
LightColor= 0.2 0.0 0.0
LightDirection= 4.4  4.5 -4
}

Naturaly it can be changed to suit your needs.  I just tried it with the Hap explorer and it can still be changed with the additive effect, it works with other lighting haps but should be changed back using the standard light hap.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Carl2 on March 24, 2009, 09:32:14 pm
  Have to mention I'm using this with a nude skin, just tried it again with the standard clothing and the lighting is not as effective. The  red lights on a red shirt is difficult to see.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on March 25, 2009, 11:44:24 am
Thanks Carl  8)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: apollon on April 28, 2009, 01:36:35 am
Hello Freddy, thank you for giving us this elegant tool!
Sadly, for some reason I can't run it properly on my system. The program loads OK, but as soon as the hap preview window appears, I get an error message, saying: "The value 1000000000 is invalid for 'Value'. 'Value' should be between 'minimum' and 'maximum'. Parameter name: Value."
I can choose to ignore or abort. When I choose ignore, the error just comes again. If I press the escape key and close the preview window fast enough, I get rid of the error, and the rest of your program runs fine, until I try to load a character, and the trouble starts all over again.
I could post the details of the error message for you, but I don't know if they would be any help, since I'm running a German WinXp.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 28, 2009, 11:53:32 am
Hi apollon.  This is an odd error but I had heard of one other person having it too.  I'm not sure which element may be causing it.   Is that all the error message says ?  Is the figure '1000000000' exactly what it says ?

I will take a look at it.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: apollon on April 28, 2009, 02:04:34 pm
Yes, the figure is exactly 1000000000 (9 zeroes).
When I click on "details", I get the following:
Code
System.ArgumentOutOfRangeException: Der Wert 1000000000 ist für Value ungültig. Value sollte zwischen 'minimum' und 'maximum' liegen.
Parametername: Value
   bei System.Windows.Forms.ScrollBar.set_Value(Int32 value)
   bei HapExplorer.ControlPanel.GetMaterialSettings()
   bei HapExplorer.ControlPanel.PauseTimer_Tick(Object sender, EventArgs e)
   bei System.Windows.Forms.Timer.OnTick(EventArgs e)
   bei System.Windows.Forms.Timer.TimerNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)
   bei System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 29, 2009, 12:50:54 pm
Thanks, that may help track down the problem.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 29, 2009, 02:41:09 pm
In english a decimal point is shown as 1.0 or 1 dot 0 in words.

Is this the same in Germany ?  How do you show the decimal point in German please ?

I am guessing the German version of Windows uses what we call a comma ?  Meaning an ','

This could be what is causing the problem as the other person I know who had this problem was a French member and maybe the French Windows uses a comma too to represent the decimal point.

Basically what I am trying to say is that internally this might be causing the problem.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 29, 2009, 04:03:13 pm
I've did a little messing around assuming that was the problem.  There may be further euro-bugs !

Try this version out...

Edit : file removed as it's not working.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: apollon on April 30, 2009, 01:24:26 am
Yes, almost all European countries use the comma as the decimal point, including the German-speaking ones. Good one; I would never have considered that as a possible source of the problem. I think you're on the right track with that one.

I just tried the new version you uploaded, but it won't install. I get the following error (I translated it):

Code
PLATFORM VERSION
Windows : 5.1.2600.131072 (Win32NT)
Common Language Runtime : 2.0.50727.1433
System.Deployment.dll : 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400)
mscorwks.dll : 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400)
dfdll.dll : 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400)
dfshim.dll : 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400)

SOURCES
URL : file:///D:/Dokumente%20und%20Einstellungen/Ilias/Desktop/HapExplorer_0_8_0_14/HapExplorer_0_8_0_14/HapExplorer.application

ERROR SUMMARY
* Activation of D:\Dokumente und Einstellungen\Ilias\Desktop\HapExplorer_0_8_0_14\HapExplorer_0_8_0_14\HapExplorer.application has lead to an exception. The following errors were discovered:
+ Exception at parsing the manifest of 'file:///D:/Dokumente%20und%20Einstellungen/Ilias/Desktop/HapExplorer_0_8_0_14/HapExplorer_0_8_0_14/HapExplorer.application': The Manifest is probably invalied, or the file could not be opened.
+ The XML signature of the manifests is invalid.
+ There was no signature in the application.


ERRIR DETAILS
* [30.04.2009 02:13:54] System.Deployment.Application.InvalidDeploymentException (ManifestParse)
- Exception at parsing the manifest of 'file:///D:/Dokumente%20und%20Einstellungen/Ilias/Desktop/HapExplorer_0_8_0_14/HapExplorer_0_8_0_14/HapExplorer.application': The manifest is probably invalid, or the file could not be opened.
- Source: System.Deployment
- Stapelüberwachung [I'M SORRY, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT WORD MEANS]:
at System.Deployment.Application.ManifestReader.FromDocument(String localPath, ManifestType manifestType, Uri sourceUri)
at System.Deployment.Application.DownloadManager.DownloadDeploymentManifestDirectBypass(SubscriptionStore subStore, Uri& sourceUri, TempFile& tempFile, SubscriptionState& subState, IDownloadNotification notification, DownloadOptions options, ServerInformation& serverInformation)
at System.Deployment.Application.DownloadManager.DownloadDeploymentManifestBypass(SubscriptionStore subStore, Uri& sourceUri, TempFile& tempFile, SubscriptionState& subState, IDownloadNotification notification, DownloadOptions options)
at System.Deployment.Application.ApplicationActivator.PerformDeploymentActivation(Uri activationUri, Boolean isShortcut, String textualSubId, String deploymentProviderUrlFromExtension)
at System.Deployment.Application.ApplicationActivator.ActivateDeploymentWorker(Object state)
--- Internal Exception ---
System.Deployment.Application.InvalidDeploymentException (SignatureValidation)
- The XML signature of the Manifests is invalid.
- Source: System.Deployment
- Stapelüberwachung [THAT WORD AGAIN, SORRY]:
at System.Deployment.Application.Manifest.AssemblyManifest.ValidateSignature(Stream s)
at System.Deployment.Application.ManifestReader.FromDocument(String localPath, ManifestType manifestType, Uri sourceUri)
--- Internal Exception ---
System.Security.Cryptography.CryptographicException
- There was no signature in the application.

- Source: System.Deployment
- Stapelüberwachung [ONCE MORE, THAT ACCURSED WORD]:
at System.Deployment.Internal.CodeSigning.SignedCmiManifest.Verify(CmiManifestVerifyFlags verifyFlags)
at System.Deployment.Application.Manifest.AssemblyManifest.ValidateSignature(Stream s)

It could be that I have to uninstall the old version first, but I don't know how to do that.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 30, 2009, 11:05:50 am
Oh dear.  Well you can try un-installing it by using the control panel and using 'add or remove programs'.  I don't think this is the problem though.  It installs fine here, this is a new problem.   I will see what I can do.  Thanks for the translation :)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: GT40 on April 30, 2009, 12:17:01 pm

One of both French members is still trying to install Hap Explorer, lol. Thanks for the work you are doing, Freddy. Sure that the next try will be the good one. :D



Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 30, 2009, 04:53:48 pm
Yeah this is a lot of fun !  Well I am learning things.  The problem seems to be that I needed to sign the program with a certificate.  What I did on that last version was to not include the certificate/signature which is probably why the computer rejected it.  Originally the program was set up with a default year long certificate.  So that has obviously run out now.  Makes me wonder how many people this affected.

All this means I have now learnt how to make certificates, this one is valid till 2015, so fingers crossed...

Many thanks for the translations apollon  ;D

Edit : version removed as it still did not work !

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: apollon on April 30, 2009, 07:52:32 pm
Heh, it's me, once again. ;D
The application installs OK now, but the 1000000000 error persists. Here's the translated error report:

Code
************** Exception **************
System.ArgumentOutOfRangeException: The value 1000000000 is invalid for Value. Value should range between 'minimum' and 'maximum'.
Parameter name: Value
   at System.Windows.Forms.ScrollBar.set_Value(Int32 value)
   at HapExplorer.ControlPanel.GetMaterialSettings()
   at HapExplorer.ControlPanel.PauseTimer_Tick(Object sender, EventArgs e)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Timer.OnTick(EventArgs e)
   at System.Windows.Forms.Timer.TimerNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)
   at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)


************** Loaded Assemblies **************
mscorlib
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.NET/Framework/v2.0.50727/mscorlib.dll.
----------------------------------------
HapExplorer
    Assembly-Version: 1.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 1.0.0.0.
    CodeBase: file:///D:/Dokumente%20und%20Einstellungen/Ilias/Lokale%20Einstellungen/Apps/2.0/4CMTJ5WH.BXM/QVZWCA3O.RGG/hape..tion_2509394a011cb8c3_0000.0008_8e11fef252923606/HapExplorer.exe.
----------------------------------------
Microsoft.VisualBasic
    Assembly-Version: 8.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 8.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/Microsoft.VisualBasic/8.0.0.0__b03f5f7f11d50a3a/Microsoft.VisualBasic.dll.
----------------------------------------
System
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System/2.0.0.0__b77a5c561934e089/System.dll.
----------------------------------------
System.Windows.Forms
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Windows.Forms/2.0.0.0__b77a5c561934e089/System.Windows.Forms.dll.
----------------------------------------
System.Drawing
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Drawing/2.0.0.0__b03f5f7f11d50a3a/System.Drawing.dll.
----------------------------------------
System.Runtime.Remoting
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Runtime.Remoting/2.0.0.0__b77a5c561934e089/System.Runtime.Remoting.dll.
----------------------------------------
AxInterop.ACTIVEHAPTEKXLib
    Assembly-Version: 1.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 1.0.0.0.
    CodeBase: file:///D:/Dokumente%20und%20Einstellungen/Ilias/Lokale%20Einstellungen/Apps/2.0/4CMTJ5WH.BXM/QVZWCA3O.RGG/hape..tion_2509394a011cb8c3_0000.0008_8e11fef252923606/AxInterop.ACTIVEHAPTEKXLib.DLL.
----------------------------------------
System.Configuration
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Configuration/2.0.0.0__b03f5f7f11d50a3a/System.Configuration.dll.
----------------------------------------
System.Xml
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Xml/2.0.0.0__b77a5c561934e089/System.Xml.dll.
----------------------------------------
System.Windows.Forms.resources
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/System.Windows.Forms.resources/2.0.0.0_de_b77a5c561934e089/System.Windows.Forms.resources.dll.
----------------------------------------
Interop.ACTIVEHAPTEKXLib
    Assembly-Version: 1.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 1.0.0.0.
    CodeBase: file:///D:/Dokumente%20und%20Einstellungen/Ilias/Lokale%20Einstellungen/Apps/2.0/4CMTJ5WH.BXM/QVZWCA3O.RGG/hape..tion_2509394a011cb8c3_0000.0008_8e11fef252923606/Interop.ACTIVEHAPTEKXLib.DLL.
----------------------------------------
Accessibility
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/assembly/GAC_MSIL/Accessibility/2.0.0.0__b03f5f7f11d50a3a/Accessibility.dll.
----------------------------------------
mscorlib.resources
    Assembly-Version: 2.0.0.0.
    Win32-Version: 2.0.50727.1433 (REDBITS.050727-1400).
    CodeBase: file:///D:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.NET/Framework/v2.0.50727/mscorlib.dll.
----------------------------------------

A thousand thanks for all the work you're doing for us!
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 30, 2009, 08:47:45 pm
Hmm.  GT40 can you do me a favour please ?

Can you open up any old Haptek figure and then get the console up, then do this query - "current material" (without the quotes).

Then post here exactly what it responds with please.  I need to see how it outputs the figures and see what it is using for a decimal point.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 30, 2009, 09:23:53 pm
Apollon, did you un-install the old version before installing the new version please ?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on April 30, 2009, 09:57:21 pm
This is the last one for today.  I found some info on this problem on the internet.  I made a few alterations.  I just want to get beyond this bug, but I think there will be problems with controlling the materials too, but that can wait for now.

Try this :

Please un-install the old version first, using 'control panel' - > 'add or remove programs'.

EDIT : File moved - please see page 1 for this latest release.


Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: apollon on May 01, 2009, 01:57:43 am
Duuuude.... IT WORKS! :D
You did it!
I'll report back soon, I'm going to check it out now. ;)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Maviarab on May 01, 2009, 09:59:23 am
And once again children...

The magical wizard, he who lives high up on the craggy mountain, far far far far far far far (go make a coffee folks...)

far far far away...proves to the watching world that he is, without doubt, the master of knowledge thay they all shall seek :D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: GT40 on May 01, 2009, 10:39:03 am

q: current material
a: d= 1.000 1.000 1.000 1.000 a= 1.000 1.000 1.000 1.000 s= 0.300 0.300 0.300 1.000 e= 0.000 0.000 0.000 1.000 sp= 10.000

Not sure it's useful now. Glad for apollon.  ;)

Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on May 01, 2009, 01:26:37 pm
Yay! Magical wizard ? LOL, well I try.

That's a relief.  As suspected, It was being caused by the decimal point marker.

If you are in England, then where I was trying to multiply with the English 1.000 (1 dot 000 = 1) it was fine.

But in Germany because you use a dot to show thousands instead, it was multiplying by a thousand instead of 1 - so for example if a number was 0.450 Hap Explorer was treating it like a whole 450.  Visual Basic only uses the American/English marker so that was confusing it.

Well I never knew we had different ways of showing numbers like this, so I learnt something new.

Thanks GT40, that does help because now I know that Haptek sticks to using a dot for the decimal point.  Hopefully it will now work for you too.

I still need to look at the code because I think there may still be a bug with controlling the materials in the 'material' tab.

If anyone has time can they let me know how it is displaying the decimal point in the 'material' tab please ?  If it's showing each one as '1.000' or whatever then there should not be a problem, but if it is showing things like '1,000' then I will have to recode that bit too.

Many thanks for the assistance, it is greatly appreciated.   ;D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Art on May 01, 2009, 11:16:58 pm
Hail all great and powerful wizard from (far x 1,000) away places. He who teaches by learning and learns by teaching is wise indeed.

 ;)

As Saint Peter said to Joan d'Arc upon her arrival...Well done my child...well done indeed! (or was that extra crispy?)
 ::)
Title: Re: Hap Explorer BETA
Post by: Freddy on May 02, 2009, 03:16:47 pm
 :D  Thanks!
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: jpijper on February 15, 2010, 09:59:32 am
Hello Freddy,

I realize this is all old stuff for you, but I started working with Haptek stuff only a few weeks ago. I have to say I love your Haptek Explorer - extremely useful!

I was wondering, where do you get your list of parameters from? Is it the result of parsing the figureDef files, or do you use API calls for that? Same question really for switches and states.

I am asking because I will be doing some programming for the Haptek avatars, so I am curious. I hardly dare ask, but would it be possible to have a copy of your source code for the HapExplorer? I do my programming with C# and I am sure that would be very useful for me. I'll understand perfectly if you say no to that.

Anyway, thanks for your useful HapExplorer!

Jan Roelof.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on February 19, 2010, 02:20:31 pm
Hi Jan,

Thanks for the kind words.

Sorry it took me a while to answer.  Basically yes I parsed the text files directly from the hap-temp folder and pulled out all the parameters and switches of anything that was currently active in the Haptek Player.

It's been a while, obviously, since I did this so my memory of exactly how is not great, in fact it is completely blank.  I will dig out the files later.  Do you use Visual Studio and would you have access to Visual Basic ?  If so then I can see about sending you the source.

Let me know if you are still interested.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: jpijper on February 19, 2010, 02:35:31 pm
Hi Freddy,

Thanks for responding!. Yes, I use Visual Studio Professional, so that includes VB.
And yes, I am still interested ;)

Thanks!
Jan Roelof.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on February 19, 2010, 04:18:55 pm
Email sent  ;D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Carl2 on April 06, 2010, 02:04:05 pm
Freddy,
  I just downloaded and tried the latest download from Zabaware, Hal works fine on this machine, quick test.  Next I plan to download the Hapexplorer, thought I'd ask before downloading, It will work ok with Win 7 on a quad?
  Just tried the Hap Player from Haptek, same problem.  I can't find the uncompressed file files in the Haptek temp folder.  Doing this quickly this morning, have to look later when I have more time.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on April 06, 2010, 02:19:17 pm
To be honest I don't know, I doubt it will work on a multi-core processor due to it using the Haptek Player.  I have abandoned Hap Explorer now so there will not be a fix from me.  The best I can suggest is to try that program Nige posted on Zabaware to limit the number of cores the Haptek player will try to use.

It's not really something I can fix anyway, Haptek should have done that a long long time ago.  I guess you could try emailing them, but don't hold your breath.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Carl2 on April 06, 2010, 09:57:49 pm
Freddy,
  That's unfortunate,  I liked that quite a bit was thinking trying to create a goodbye wave with it.  I was able to pull out the body noise which I use so the head isn't on a body that seems like a statue.
  Robert M at Zabaware must have the answer,  but this your project. 
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on April 07, 2010, 03:00:06 pm
Well I passed on the source code to another programmer a while back and asked him to let us know if he did anything cool with it, so maybe he will work out how to get it to work with quad cores etc...
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Carl2 on April 08, 2010, 12:30:31 am
  Thank you Freddy,  I really liked and appreciated that piece of work that you did. I hope there is a fix that will keep it around for years.  I like Haptek anyways and from what I saw happening with Orge, I really didn't see anything.
  To be honest I was surprized  you're not involved in Orge.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on April 08, 2010, 03:48:27 pm
Thanks Carl.  Well I don't know why I haven't got into Ogre much yet.  I guess it is because I am working on a lot of other things at the moment that take priority.  I can roughly understand what is involved but it is another thing to make that happen.

The route I would probably take is this ..


I'd be happy to pass on all that though and wait until we have characters for Ogre then just do skins for them !  Although there's always scope for any kind of objects that could be used in a scene, like Haptek with it's accessories... which is probably a lot simpler than making humans or whatever.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Carl2 on April 09, 2010, 01:28:44 pm
  Thanks for adding that, found it very useful in understanding how they all work together.  I remember at one time I had Blender, TrueSpace Downloads In a computer,  Both seemed a little complex and I can't imagine trying to build a skeleton nevermind trying to get it to walk.
  I had noticed that they do sell models for a reasonable price, possibly using converters would speed up the project.
 Carl 2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on April 09, 2010, 02:27:29 pm
Yes, you can always get your hands on free models too.  Recently here we were talking about a program called Make Human (http://www.makehuman.org/), which might be a useful tool for this.

You could also use the models from Poser and grab their .OBJ versions and then import them into Blender, then presumably export them to Ogre format (as Blender can do that).  I am not sure where you would go from there though as I don't know anything about skeletons etc.  But it might be worth a look.

I am guessing that the XML file that is needed is going to be something similar to Haptek's Figure Definition files.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Carl2 on April 09, 2010, 11:15:11 pm
Wanted to put in the latest on the problem with the Hap Player,  it was working with problems, tried Nige's fix, car.exe and it wasn't fixing for me, Nige gave me some instructions and the Hap Player works as it should.  Nige and myself can't find the uncompressed files.
Thanks for the time and effort.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on April 11, 2010, 01:35:44 pm
Have you tried searching for the Hap temp folder ?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Carl2 on April 11, 2010, 09:20:49 pm
  On your advice I tried again,  started Hal with Jiggly, tried explorer and checked the Haptek folder for the temp file, not there.  Did a search for temp, nothing to do with Haptek,  Possibily it has put the temp files into memory, really belongs there.
  I opened task manager, with Hal running used Memory was 1.49 Gb,  as soon as I closed Hal it dropped to 1.43 Gb.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on April 11, 2010, 09:47:23 pm
It's usually called 'hap_temp' isn't it ?

I tried installing the Haptek Player on W7 and get an error - so it won't even install here.

Sorry mate I give up on Haptek.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Carl2 on April 12, 2010, 12:57:12 am
  Don't give up, I just put the Hap Player in this computer, It's Haptek and their website.  I put it in, put it in again with the reccomended settings, put it in again.
Went to Zabaware downloaded Niges fix.  Came here and downloaded Jiggly and it's working.  I ran into a problem with Jiggly,  upper arms and breasts had quick short movements, strange looking.  Put it in this computer because it has a better video card and the problem is gone.
  If you downloaded the player it should be in the computer, get Niges fix and it will work.  Hal works without the fix.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on April 13, 2010, 02:43:40 pm
I downloaded the installer from Haptek and ran it from my machine but it doesn't work.  Did you use the web installer ?  To be honest I have lost interest in Haptek so it's no biggie for me.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Carl2 on April 14, 2010, 12:22:22 am
    I was just at Zabaware so you already know, Rob is having a character made.  I should have asked the time frame until it will be released.
Haptek Player, I downloaded and it installed 3 times.  I usualy save frist, don't think we have a choice for the Haptek player.  Just downloaded the SDK for Haptek.  If the Haptek folder is there, It is in Program Files (x86) not the standard Program files. 
  I went to the website, If you click Haptek Player at the bottom you have a choice. frist you have to install the active X.   I just downloaded the file instead of auto install.  The web page is as bad as the player.
  So if Haptek is in the Program File (x86) click it.  You'll need the car.exe from Nige so the Player will not become unresponsive like there website.
Carl2
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on May 16, 2010, 03:54:20 pm
Hey Carl, just curious did you manage to get Hap Explorer to work with Nige's solution ?

I might try installing Haptek again, not sure what the problem was down this end.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: GT40 on May 16, 2010, 07:17:57 pm

Freddy, as you know, I have never been able to use your Hap Explorer because my computer always refused to install Framework version 3.5 (I have XP, well-known MS issue). ???

Bye Haptek, now I'm in SL. After a lot of search, I have finally found a third-party program allowing to export a group list to RL. I was happy when I discovered that this program needs... Framework 3.5.

I must continue to manually and daily check the members of my group. Aaargh, (second) life is cruel... :)

Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on May 17, 2010, 08:06:25 am
Too bad  :( but yes a lot of programs and most home made software needs some form of .NET  I didn't know that it is a common problem.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: GT40 on May 17, 2010, 10:57:38 am

I have 1.0, 1.1, 2.0, 3.0 but impossible to install 3.5...  >:(

Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Duskrider on May 17, 2010, 03:48:44 pm
My desktop XP computer won't accept the net 3.5
So I went for years never seeing your hap explorer.
Then about 4 months ago my sis got a win7 and gave me her XP laptop.
Lo and behold it got net 3.5 on it and I enjoy your hap explorer.   
;D                          ;D                           ;D                              ;D                     ;D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on May 18, 2010, 09:38:51 pm
GT40, what a pain that is.  :(

At least it worked for you Dusky, I am glad you found it useful - do you make some of your poses with it may I ask ?
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Data on May 19, 2010, 10:58:50 am
.net framework has caused me many a problem with PC’s, so many times now I have seen it install only to fail and revert, MS have a number of fixes but for me they hardly ever work.

This kind of thing makes me think of those lovely registry cleaners, I can’t prove it but its strange that many people that have this problem have used them.

I repeat don’t ever use registry cleaners people. 
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Duskrider on May 19, 2010, 12:42:15 pm

I noticed right off it good for making poses.
I would have used but am use to my own way of doing.
I did find very handy the inner haps in my girl.
I changed strength in some of them and made her more as I like her.
If only we  could do humans that way, be so much fun.  :D
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on May 20, 2010, 03:14:06 pm
Well I am glad you found some uses for it Dusky :)

As for registry cleaners; I gave up on the idea I had recently to get one.  I remember a long time ago when I was on Window 98 I tried some kind of PC Tuner (you know how they all say they can make your PC run faster - BS!) and it had a registry cleaner.  So I tried that and it screwed up my PC so badly I had to reinstall the OS.   So I will not be using one.
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Artimendus on October 14, 2011, 09:09:57 am
well, I've been attempting to utilize the program using compatibility settings for various versions of windows to no avail. I'm currently running windows 7 home premium, and no matter what I attempt it's always a no-go. I understand that you're no longer giving support or advice for the program and it pains me to see that because I've found a program that I would very much like to work with and become proficient at. Seeing as how Haptek doesn't seem to care about their product or it's clients anymore, I thought that I'd found a useful subtitute to take care of some ideas and tinkering I'd like to accomplish. You have my regards for delving into the wind and attempting to alleviate a problem and supply a viable solution. I only write to inform you of the issues associated with the program ( as you stated you wished others that attempted to use the program on other systems inform you of)..
Title: Re: Hap Explorer
Post by: Freddy on October 14, 2011, 02:08:24 pm
Yes I no longer work on this program I am afraid.  I don't think I could find my project now either and since then Visual Studio has changed too, so it would mean updating a lot of it.  Plus Haptek does not like multi core PCs and I don't know how to get around that. I just don't have the enthusiasm to do it and as Haptek is really dead technology now; no desire either.

Have you tried XP Mode ?

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtual-pc/download.aspx (http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtual-pc/download.aspx)

I had an old scanner that would not work on W7 but it works fine using XP Mode....just a thought.

If I make any tools in future, it will be for Zabaware's character engine when it is complete :

http://peerbackers.com/projects/3d-character-animation-engine-for-chatbots (http://peerbackers.com/projects/3d-character-animation-engine-for-chatbots)