If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.

  • 37 Replies
  • 4627 Views
*

Korrelan

  • Trusty Member
  • ***********
  • Eve
  • *
  • 1454
  • Look into my eyes! WOAH!
    • YouTube
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #15 on: May 31, 2019, 11:23:05 pm »
Mass = ish…

Humans  - 350 million ton
Ants - 300 million ton
Termites - 445 million ton
Antarctic krill - 500 million ton
Cows – 650 million ton
Ocean Microbes between 350,000 and 550,000 million ton

 :)
It thunk... therefore it is!...    /    Project Page    /    KorrTecx Website

*

LOCKSUIT

  • Emerged from nothing
  • Trusty Member
  • *******************
  • Prometheus
  • *
  • 4659
  • First it wiggles, then it is rewarded.
    • Main Project Thread
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2019, 11:30:03 pm »
Nice.

SO: (refining my theory lol) The top food chain predators eat more food and populate more, for the given Local environment. However, cows are land animals, which means we are on the same level and they are locatable/findable food (remember uni-cells ran out of edible food/space, it happens each stage) so what that means is humans DO out-mass cows HOWEVER what humans have actually done is prepared themselves MORE food, and hence it could be said: The mass of the cows is soon to be the mass of the people...

edit: Or, there's a (small) possibility I'm just glued to my belief, like we glued to resisting saying we are just machines.
Nah...not here
Emergent          https://openai.com/blog/

*

HS

  • Trusty Member
  • **********
  • Millennium Man
  • *
  • 1175
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2019, 12:58:41 am »
I propose that the usable mass transfer is constant. Cows eat the same amount of usable mass as humans get from eating the cows. The populations naturally fluctuate around this balance point. Like water flowing through three watering cans. The same amount has to flow into the middle one as is flowing into the  last one. Otherwise the water levels naturally rise/fall (births/deaths) until the flow rate becomes constant again.

*

Art

  • At the end of the game, the King and Pawn go into the same box.
  • Trusty Member
  • **********************
  • Colossus
  • *
  • 5865
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2019, 01:20:08 pm »
People are living longer and putting more people on this planet.
One day, the current food sources that sustain the animals and the people will no longer be viable.

Overpopulation will be a horrible state of existence for humanity. It will not end well at all!!!
In the world of AI, it's the thought that counts!

*

Korrelan

  • Trusty Member
  • ***********
  • Eve
  • *
  • 1454
  • Look into my eyes! WOAH!
    • YouTube
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2019, 01:32:53 pm »
There's always Soylent Green.

 :)
It thunk... therefore it is!...    /    Project Page    /    KorrTecx Website

*

LOCKSUIT

  • Emerged from nothing
  • Trusty Member
  • *******************
  • Prometheus
  • *
  • 4659
  • First it wiggles, then it is rewarded.
    • Main Project Thread
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2019, 01:54:57 pm »
Soylent Green is REAL. The rich get to eat the poor! Money buys food. Poverty. Food & money are big things we seek.
Emergent          https://openai.com/blog/

*

Korrelan

  • Trusty Member
  • ***********
  • Eve
  • *
  • 1454
  • Look into my eyes! WOAH!
    • YouTube
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #21 on: June 01, 2019, 02:15:05 pm »
Quote
Soylent Green is REAL. The rich get to eat the poor! Money buys food. Poverty. Food & money are big things we seek.

That's it... I have to say something... you're starting to believe your own bullshit! 

Lock, may I suggest you take some time away from the internet.  Go lie down in a dark room and collect your thoughts.  The so called theories you have been spouting just lately are nonsensical crap.

 :)
It thunk... therefore it is!...    /    Project Page    /    KorrTecx Website

*

Art

  • At the end of the game, the King and Pawn go into the same box.
  • Trusty Member
  • **********************
  • Colossus
  • *
  • 5865
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #22 on: June 01, 2019, 07:00:28 pm »
That's putting it delicately... ;)
In the world of AI, it's the thought that counts!

*

WriterOfMinds

  • Trusty Member
  • ********
  • Replicant
  • *
  • 606
    • WriterOfMinds Blog
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2019, 03:37:31 am »
Here are some thoughts that might be helpful/interesting.

1. Natural selection only "cares" about how good you are at passing on your genes. By that metric, all species alive today that are maintaining or increasing their populations are equally "advanced" or "evolved." I don't mean to imply that there is nothing uniquely advantageous about the human combination of intellect, mobility, and dexterous fingers ... we excel at remodeling the environment to suit our needs, and making tools that let us beat other creatures in one-on-one fights. BUT, other species have other survival skills that are working out great for them. Natural selection has not favored humans over bacteria; our package of talents is not inherently more "fit."

2. Life is diversified to fill available niches/roles. We humans aren't necessarily here to exploit more resources than bacteria; we're here to exploit *different* ones. I happily coexist with the billions of bacteria in my house (setting aside pathogens for the moment) because they have nothing I want, and I have nothing they want. I actually create a lot of great microbe habitat just by existing, at no cost to myself.

A horse and a finch have no quarrel, because they occupy different parts of the available space and they eat different things.  The horse is bigger and consumes more calories, and maybe horses as a population have a higher cell count (say they do for the sake of argument ... I don't know), but this doesn't mean that finches would have any incentive to evolve into horses. They'd be abandoning their current food base of seeds to compete with all the existing horses for grass. Why do that? However, if there are food sources that no one is currently using ... like seeds that are hard to open ... finches might have an incentive to develop specialized beaks to get at them.

3. Being at the top of the food chain actually tends to reduce the total biomass of your species. With a few unusual exceptions, all life on earth is ultimately powered by energy from the sun, which plants (the producers) use to make nutrients. Every time something eats and digests something else, energy is lost in transfer. So the more layers away your food source is from the producers, the less total energy there is for you to exploit. Have you ever thought about why none of our traditional farmed animals are apex predators? We *don't* usually eat lions -- we prefer to feed on the lower layers -- and one reason is that it's more efficient. And some people think that if the human population keeps growing, we'll have to reduce the amount of meat eaten per person to avoid starving. We could sustain more humans if they were all going straight to the producers for their energy.

4. When humans directly compete with some other life form, we can end up wiping that life form out. E.g. we extirpated the large predators who competed with us for livestock/game from large swaths of the earth. And yet, more recently we've pushed back on that trend and elected to repopulate some of our competitor species for aesthetic or moral reasons. It's like we also care about our *quality* of life and aren't just interested in reproducing and eating as much as possible. Weird.

*

LOCKSUIT

  • Emerged from nothing
  • Trusty Member
  • *******************
  • Prometheus
  • *
  • 4659
  • First it wiggles, then it is rewarded.
    • Main Project Thread
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2019, 03:55:51 am »
At your #4, we extinct out dangerous but then try to bring back endangered species. This is because we seek food and fight pain, hence beasts, so we may kill them either way, and also because we seek to fight pain and hence death and we know what we 'special things' look like and so anything that looks like us is valued...so humans 'love' animals... Also, some animals are kept alive in tons so we can feed humans.
Emergent          https://openai.com/blog/

*

LOCKSUIT

  • Emerged from nothing
  • Trusty Member
  • *******************
  • Prometheus
  • *
  • 4659
  • First it wiggles, then it is rewarded.
    • Main Project Thread
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #25 on: June 04, 2019, 04:20:09 am »
Also, our species like looking at each other, they are attracted, so humans save other humans and animals to and fro, too, us all. It's just when food is needed, look out... You may even look tasty!

Today I discovered why our lives are so short. But I'm gonna keep that one a secret.
Emergent          https://openai.com/blog/

*

LOCKSUIT

  • Emerged from nothing
  • Trusty Member
  • *******************
  • Prometheus
  • *
  • 4659
  • First it wiggles, then it is rewarded.
    • Main Project Thread
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #26 on: June 04, 2019, 06:35:14 am »
Let me blow your minds:

If you have a computer system with finite resources, and you have a desire/objective to run an evolutionary simulation that evolves ever increasingly more intelligent beings based on which can find more food and mate more, you *would want many mutations to occur fast, you *wouldn't want immortal fish to live forever - you don't have the resources to, you need to recycle them and give them short lives (mutants that have short lives have more cycle and overthrow nearby competition) - only long enough lives to test them, and that's just what the objective does, it utilizes the resources and increases intelligence. It's like Google's AlphaZero self-play. Mutations occur>they eat the weak>the best self-destruct & pass on genes>repeat. Single cells even do this! However longer lives occur later in evolution as they have the ability to learn, duplicate and reconfigure.
Emergent          https://openai.com/blog/

*

HS

  • Trusty Member
  • **********
  • Millennium Man
  • *
  • 1175
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2019, 03:52:25 am »
I wish someone had found out about evolution/natural selection earlier and founded a religion where you have to have kids at an older age than your parents. A few thousand years of that and everybody would be clamouring to join the faith that makes you live to 500!

But that's a long term solution for longevity. You got any ideas that could work within our lifetime?

*

LOCKSUIT

  • Emerged from nothing
  • Trusty Member
  • *******************
  • Prometheus
  • *
  • 4659
  • First it wiggles, then it is rewarded.
    • Main Project Thread
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2019, 04:41:34 am »
I do. It's AGI.
Emergent          https://openai.com/blog/

*

HS

  • Trusty Member
  • **********
  • Millennium Man
  • *
  • 1175
Re: If you are a Machine. A shocking finding.
« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2019, 05:16:46 am »
Sure we have a chance of creating immortal beings within our lifetimes, but us as individuals - we're doomed. How to we unravel biology? Or if we can't do that, how do we... get synthetic?

 


OpenAI Speech-to-Speech Reasoning Demo
by MikeB (AI News )
March 31, 2024, 01:00:53 pm
Say good-bye to GPUs...
by MikeB (AI News )
March 23, 2024, 09:23:52 am
Google Bard report
by ivan.moony (AI News )
February 14, 2024, 04:42:23 pm
Elon Musk's xAI Grok Chatbot
by MikeB (AI News )
December 11, 2023, 06:26:33 am
Nvidia Hype
by 8pla.net (AI News )
December 06, 2023, 10:04:52 pm
How will the OpenAI CEO being Fired affect ChatGPT?
by 8pla.net (AI News )
December 06, 2023, 09:54:25 pm
Independent AI sovereignties
by WriterOfMinds (AI News )
November 08, 2023, 04:51:21 am
LLaMA2 Meta's chatbot released
by 8pla.net (AI News )
October 18, 2023, 11:41:21 pm

Users Online

327 Guests, 0 Users

Most Online Today: 327. Most Online Ever: 2369 (November 21, 2020, 04:08:13 pm)

Articles