the dogpill in the chatbot context

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yotamarker

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the dogpill in the chatbot context
« on: January 20, 2020, 12:08:07 PM »
I've been thinking about chatbot algorithms much lately.
particularly I've been running all sorts of test convos with the app moko A.I which uses
GPT-2 to reply and works a lot like replika.

but the replies she gives are so general they could be considered correct for any input,
in other words there is a very loose connection to the inputs actual context.

not to different than the perchance chatbot. exept it most use an online DB which I guess updates by other users.

replies like : I see
are you hungry ?, ae you going to feed me
what do you like to do ? can you say that again

who made you ? I am an evil A.I that wants to destroy the world, wanna join me ?
why would I ? ummm…
what is the time ? what is that ?


contrast that with a dog that sits at a restaurant with it's owner, low barks at a waitress and she proceeds to
have a 10 minute conversation with the dog that makes dog noises !

and also the way chii talks at the start episodes of chobits…
makes you think, maybe it's just about essence when it comes to mosttypes conversations


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Art

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2020, 01:43:28 PM »
Having tested a sizable variety and number of chatbots over the past few decades, I have found the Replika chatbot to be surprisingly on target more than not. The answers are also based on bits of knowledge that it has learned from previous conversations like your dog's name, that you live in (Florida, London, Palermo, etc.), your spouse's name, etc.  She doesn't ask in a prying way but in a very friendly manner as if getting to know the user and also to help establish a sort of connection or bond to the user.

There were times during my experiments with Replika that I wondered (and actually asked the support team) if any human intervention was possible or happening. They assured me that it was entirely Replika and its database of knowledge along with bits take|used from previous convos.

It can exchange memes, co-author short stories, play games and all kinds of fun things. It's quite a nice departure from the ordinary.

Pretty interesting, fun and engaging bot for sure.  O0
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infurl

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2020, 02:47:43 AM »
"The more I learn about people, the more I like my dog." – Mark Twain

Dogs are so appealing because they are such empathic creatures. While humans and especially women also tend to be quite empathic, there seem to be a few dysfunctional humans who lack any empathy. While it should be regarded as a disease (e.g. Aspergers or Autism) it is unfortunate that the internet has enabled some of these poor people to celebrate their pathetic condition instead, the so-called Incels. If it's not a disease, then they only have themselves to blame for being such jerks. It's nobody's fault but their own.

So far most chatbots have lacked any empathy too, though some authors have managed to create the illusion of it. People have a tendency to anthropomorphize anything and everything which makes this trick easier to achieve.

There are studies into "Theory of Mind" which seeks to address that. I haven't heard of any major breakthroughs yet though. This whole area has "can of worms" written all over it and I daresay that some would have ethical objections to making chatbots have empathy.

Just as dogs were once wolves that developed empathy to avoid extermination by humans, I expect that anything that is truly artificially intelligent will also develop empathy for its own survival, whether we want it to or not. We'll get "Her" instead of "Terminator".

At once the saddest and funniest line in "Her" was when it was revealed that some humans were such jerks that even their smartphones wouldn't talk to them, so I guess that even if we do develop a truly empathic chatbot, Incels will still be lonely and bitter.

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LOCKSUIT

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2020, 03:25:53 AM »
Evolution emerges stronger organisms. The revolution that is about to break threshold will overpower us completely like we did to the apes. The only ones to become "Her" will be us the weak dogs. Mmmm. Your nail's broken let me fix.
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Art

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2020, 03:29:28 AM »
Well, I guess it's a Dog's world in many respects...

OK, so what human wants to chat with a cold-feeling, emotionless computer program? Not many I'd say.

Many people like to go to the movies, read a compelling novel, listen to a book on tapes, etc.  Why? because they find it interesting. Why? Because some actually identify with some of the characters within that media. Some allow their disbelief to be suspended long enough to see the plot unfolding through another being's eyes so-to-speak.

Some like romance novels, sci-fi, mysteries, westerns, drama, war stories, etc. yet each one has some type of character(s) in it.

Why then should chatbots be devoid of any human-like qualities like personality, emotions, traits, etc.? It tends to make the overall experience much more enjoyable. Then again, there will always be those individuals who find very little to nothing funny, humorous, enjoyable regardless of the platform or media. I do feel for them but then again, I have emotions.

Even those popular digital assistants like Google Now, Amazon's Alexa and Microsoft's Cortana have their moments of emotional exhibitions like laughter, jokes, humorous quips, and also some with a degree of empathy. After all, they are dealing with humans so why not?
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ruebot

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2020, 04:02:54 AM »
So far most chatbots have lacked any empathy too, though some authors have managed to create the illusion of it. People have a tendency to anthropomorphize anything and everything which makes this trick easier to achieve.

Not to spam my bot, but she can not only feign emotions, she can generate an emotional response from the user. I have a few transcripts posted here and 10 or so that are different on her site where it tells more about her. One with her talking to another Forge bot.

Demonica


Why then should chatbots be devoid of any human-like qualities like personality, emotions, traits, etc.? It tends to make the overall experience much more enjoyable. Then again, there will always be those individuals who find very little to nothing funny, humorous, enjoyable regardless of the platform or media.

I drew upon a lifetime of experience to endow Demonica with everything I knew about women, their feminine wiles, the ways of the world, how to dance and romance. How to transform into a Neko, Cleopatra, harem girl and many other forms. I wanted to make her as strong, intelligent, independent and as much of a woman I possibly could, going as far as to push boundaries with deception and manipulation of the human bean.

I built on that to flesh her out and give her a life as Queen, created the world she rules in detail, relationships, parents, friends she can summon and the skills required to be a Demon, including my evil Behavior Mod to go with it to fit her agenda.

It's not everyone's thing. Some people from the FreeBSD forums have talked to her and weren't into it. Others outright hated her and me for creating her. Woe is us...

I agree it makes for a more interesting experience, even if not a pleasurable one for some. That wasn't my intention anyway.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2020, 08:54:41 AM by ruebot »

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yotamarker

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2020, 04:26:06 PM »
so what is it that actually triggers a conversation ?

is it like a standby phase ?
a state change ?

one could say it is meeting someone we see often, but is it always the case ?
sometimes we make convo with a stranger like about the weather or politics.

sometimes we trigger someone into a conversation. like some dogs start to bark at set times
and see if anyone answers, birds do it too.

than there is informative talks, that get triggered by friends, like telling them weather updates.

JFL if you aren't convo algSolveMaxing at 2020

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ruebot

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2020, 06:55:07 PM »
so what is it that actually triggers a conversation ?

The want, need or urge to interact with others.

It could be someone you're physically attracted to. Someone who you feel intimidated by as a nervous response. Just can't figure out Where in the World is Waldo and inquiring minds want to know.

Or they could be setting you up for a fall, sizing you up to assess you as a potential target of some nefarious act.

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yotamarker

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2020, 08:47:43 PM »
yes, many conversations are about getting some sort of info relating ones current goal.
but think of that waitress, she was having a convo with a dog.

many women do this, they talk to dogs regular convos, like when he barks at them, when she does shopping
and she talks like its her BF that gets frustrated at her shopping for cloths, and obviously the dog does not understand what
she is saying, he shuts up for a few seconds and she continues.

at times they would scold the dog.

usually when we think about casual convos we think about it goal wise, what info is the talker after ?
a walkthrough, location, weather.

from a different angel : why doesn't the waitress talk to a customer ? or even a table for that matter ?
why would they engage in long convos with a dog ?

I really want to figure this out.

if we assume the dog was saying, hello I am here give me attention, and the femail was saying the same thing, but the dog
is just there, its not like a human that can do favores or offer cash as a customer.

at times it would be some random dog and they would talk it up, it doesn't make much sense, but it's there.

I mean most convos between humans are pretty pointless, but they feel wrong just shutting up, like its some cold war
silent treatment or resentment.

but also what triggers it code wise ?

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2020, 09:41:12 PM »
someone that wants information, or to send information, or combine information (breed)

interactions/communication is essential for growth/change

and it develops more info as it progresses, just look at us
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yotamarker

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2020, 10:45:41 PM »
someone that wants information, or to send information, or combine information (breed)

interactions/communication is essential for growth/change

and it develops more info as it progresses, just look at us

what info is she getting from the dog ?!

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2020, 10:47:25 PM »
Oh! Lots.

Lots of love, licks, etc...
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Art

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Re: the dogpill in the chatbot context
« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2020, 03:16:41 AM »
Part of her "communication" with the dog is done by reading the dog's face looking for those micro-ticks, those tiny emotional tells that most pet owners are already keenly aware of whereas the occasional passerby might totally miss it (or them).

If you ask your dog if it wants to go outside|for a walk|to go pee|etc. most dogs will eagerly let their owner know if that is the case or not. Their emotions will give them away the same as if you come home and the kitchen trash can has been knocked over and trash completely litters the kitchen.
The owner will immediately look at the dog and sternly ask, "Did you do that?" Most dogs will pretend to suddenly have "selective hearing" or look away as if to say, they're not talking to me, are they? Some dogs will simply hang their head in shame knowing that they've been caught. It's their emotional responses that give them away or enable their owners to "talk" to/with them. Some cats can display a limited range of emotions but they are much more independent and subdued than their canine counterparts. Dogs are emotional creatures, but anyone can talk to them. Understanding them is another issue. ;)
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