How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI

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WriterOfMinds

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2020, 04:01:41 pm »
Yes, some people will buy sci-fi erotica, but it does limit one's audience ... because other sci-fi fans think these things are private, rather than fuel for the mental theater.  I read Altered Carbon for the interesting ideas about interchangeable bodies etc., but I thought it was gross, and there were scenes I definitely skimmed over.  In the end, it wasn't a pleasant reading experience for me, and some people (my mother, for instance) would never read it no matter how many important high concepts it has.

I also think that our society over-emphasizes sex, and especially the cheap pleasure aspect of it, to an unhealthy degree.  I'm tired of authors thinking that sex has to be a prominent part of their book, even when it has nothing to do with the main topic or theme.

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frankinstien

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2020, 05:15:26 pm »
Yes, some people will buy sci-fi erotica, but it does limit one's audience ... because other sci-fi fans think these things are private, rather than fuel for the mental theater.  I read Altered Carbon for the interesting ideas about interchangeable bodies etc., but I thought it was gross, and there were scenes I definitely skimmed over.  In the end, it wasn't a pleasant reading experience for me, and some people (my mother, for instance) would never read it no matter how many important high concepts it has.

I also think that our society over-emphasizes sex, and especially the cheap pleasure aspect of it, to an unhealthy degree.  I'm tired of authors thinking that sex has to be a prominent part of their book, even when it has nothing to do with the main topic or theme.

I respect your opinion but those perspectives of sex are socially conditioned by those that demonize sex for their personal agenda. It is ironic if not hypocritical that a book or movie that depicts horrific murder is OK, but if sex is involved its taboo.  It makes no sense to exclude a natural behavior of humanity and claim its dirty or that pleasure is cheap. If one indulges in a dish that brings about pleasure then it's not cheap, why?  Exploring ideas, inclusive of sexual activity, is what theater, literature, and music is all about. To mandate what those activities are supposed to depict is no different than mandating how one should eat their steak or ice cream. I for one will never put Ketchup on my ice cream, but I will not judge, or force others not to or censor others for doing so.

What sex is supposed to mean is relative, not a universal constant. Particularly with apes such as Hominids where sex is not just for reproduction, it is a social activity that spans many peer to peer demands of the animal. How that manifests in cultural traditions varies greatly and our new technological society has varying perspectives of sex and is exploring new avenues of sex never before possible.

Of course the science and biology of sex in humanity is a fascinating subject and should not be repressed but explored in detail...

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WriterOfMinds

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2020, 05:48:27 pm »
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It is ironic if not hypocritical that a book or movie that depicts horrific murder is OK, but if sex is involved its taboo.

I've heard this perspective before, and I think it's based on a misunderstanding of why sex is taboo. It's not that people think it is bad; it's that people think it is private. I explained why I think that keeping sex private has value in a previous thread.

If I witnessed a murder, I would be terribly upset that the murder happened, but not terribly upset that I happened to see it.  If I walked in on a married couple in the bedroom, I would not be upset that the sex happened, but I would be upset that I happened to see it. It's for them, not me.

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If one indulges in a dish that brings about pleasure then it's not cheap, why?

I consider food pleasure to be cheap also. Again, not bad ... just comparatively low-value and boring.  Not worth exploring constantly or treating like the pinnacle of human experience, to the detriment of other things that are superior.

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To mandate what those activities are supposed to depict is no different than mandating how one should eat their steak or ice cream.

I'm not making an argument for government censorship. I'm simply pointing out that some people, including myself, are less likely (or completely unwilling) to read erotic books. And that seems to be what the OP is concerned with: the chance that he will limit his audience and exclude readers who otherwise would have enjoyed the main plot line.

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2020, 05:49:08 pm »
Heh heh, look at all these little posts you guys made in the time I was gone lol.

@orenshved You missed my post :( ?

Also another way I'd start my movie (you can take my idea if you want) is the 1st AGI in a humanoid body would be finished and turned on in a lab with many scientists, it would get up off it's chair and we would see out its eyes everything 100 times slower. Then suddenly, it starts kicking and punching the ones near it, handling all 20 scientists simultaneously trying to retain it from escaping. It then starts running out the door down the hallway and music is playing with a techno-y beat with a theme of confidence like the first [4] seconds of the following looped (funny the name of this game is called the great escape LOL!) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=24fZaLtz5Oc

and then the AGI gains intelligence the site is being nuked soon and sends away a detailed blueprint of itself with an improvement (nanotechnology) to a scientist and is later reconstructed somewhere else in a year's time.
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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2020, 05:59:36 pm »
@WoM We should be dishonored to see death and honored to see love :)

No harm either way... Except for the dead guy....

The whole thing about stepping in on a married couple being a bad idea is that you may be dangerous, they don't "know" you. Once they do, you may be really open to them!

Anyway, keep 6 feet apart :] ..... new norm
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frankinstien

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2020, 06:04:19 pm »
I'm not making an argument for government censorship. I'm simply pointing out that some people, including myself, are less likely (or completely unwilling) to read erotic books. And that seems to be what the OP is concerned with: the chance that he will limit his audience and exclude readers who otherwise would have enjoyed the main plot line.

My point wasn't government censorship but social censorship no different than the late eighties where artificial neural networks were a taboo! No one would view the individual using such an approach seriously or would actually be offended by their use. There were several OCR tools at the time that did use neural networks but the authors or companies that developed them never mentioned their use because of the repercussion or lack of confidence that would have been perceived in their tool. Social censorship is the most dangerous form of repression and prevents the exploration of topics by defunding them or in this case not writing about a topic that explores an AGI where it can mimic the signaling of sexual ecstasy and what that means of who and what we are...

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frankinstien

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2020, 06:15:02 pm »
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I consider food pleasure to be cheap also. Again, not bad ... just comparatively low-value and boring.  Not worth exploring constantly or treating like the pinnacle of human experience, to the detriment of other things that are superior.

Not to be too overbearing but here too you are applying a universal constant and for those you influence perhaps blocking a venue of reward. After all, what you deem superior is not necessarily the panacea you believe. Think about it this way: For those that do like to explore food for its pleasure will be exploring the use of materials that you would never try. The use of those materials can have fantastic health benefits and/or even be used in a different application that renders benefits never imagined.  Society should not block ideas or pursuits simply because they are offended. If that were the case science would have never turned into what it is today...
« Last Edit: June 24, 2020, 06:45:30 pm by frankinstien »

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WriterOfMinds

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2020, 06:54:30 pm »
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Think about it this way: For those that do like to explore food for its pleasure will be exploring the use of materials that you would never try. The use of those materials can have fantastic health benefits and/or even be used in a different application that renders benefits never imagined

When I consider the practical effects of an emphasis on food-as-pleasure, I see a lot more harm than good. Animal death and suffering. Environmental damage. Obesity. Diet-related degenerative diseases. You tell someone that a food is harming them or others, and they say, "But I could never give up X, I enjoy it so!"

IMO, the world would be a better place if we didn't care very much about the sensory properties of our food. Then we could choose the foods that would be healthiest for us and most compassionate toward others, without being influenced by anything else.

This is taking the thread off-topic, so I'll say no more on the subject.

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frankinstien

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2020, 07:22:53 pm »
IMO, the world would be a better place if we didn't care very much about the sensory properties of our food. Then we could choose the foods that would be healthiest for us and most compassionate toward others, without being influenced by anything else.

But the biology of the animal doesn't work that way. Our nervous system inclusive of the olfactory bulb is used to motivate us to find and eat food because it's delicious. That adaptation worked in the wild where delicious food usually meant healthy food.  Even then the issue of animal suffering still prevails in the wild. E.g. the documentary that depicts a Zebra being eaten alive by a lion as the Zebra watches the lion gorge on its belly! You're trying to justify not liking delicious foods for the sake of preventing problems that can be associated with eating rather than solving those problems within the context of the animal's biology. From your perspective then we can't even explore AGI because that involves machines that use electricity which is generated by fossil fuels, mostly, that have health hazards and environmental hazards. We should just all go back to the stone age where we were much more symbiotic with the environment! Either that or pare down the human population to something that's more sustainable using our current state of technology...
« Last Edit: June 24, 2020, 10:15:37 pm by frankinstien »

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2020, 08:54:24 pm »
Everything is tied to survival in Evolution: food, reproducing, shelter, computers, cars. No matter if you love something, the longer surviving structure overpopulates the land! Bye! And, Hello new!

We do need to sometimes go back home before attack a prey unarmed, so yes avoiding high sugar foods could be best.
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orenshved

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #25 on: June 25, 2020, 09:40:21 am »
I am letting it win, That's what I wrote in the original post :) (in the sense that being defeated was part of its plan all along). The rest is a bit too erotic IMO... not sure how much of an audience is there for sci fi erotica  ;D

Plenty: https://www.ranker.com/list/star-trek_s-hottest-women-of-all-time/switchdoctor
Altered Carbon
ALL of H.K. Morgan's books
Asimov's "the gods themselves"
Stephen R Donaldson - sci-fi series.
Charles Stross books
Magic University Series by Cecilia Tan
Kushiel’s Dart by Jacqueline Carey
 Lost Girls by Alan Moore & Melinda Gebbie
Lilith’s Brood by Octavia E. Butler
Sex Criminals by Matt Fraction & Chip Zdarsky
 The Sleeping Beauty Quartet by A.N. Roquelaure
The Sharing Knife (four volumes) by Lois Bujold

To name a few...  >:D

All right, all right... I stand corrected  ;D
But it's still not the direction I'm going for  ;)

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #26 on: June 25, 2020, 08:39:30 pm »
I wonder if sections of pipes under roads, or in the walls of buildings could be turned into extremely powerful induction heaters. It might work if good pipe geometries could be found, and if the pipe casings were conductive (steel, copper, aluminum). Faucets could then be opened for active water cooling. This could heat up metal components in the AI, which might, among other things, compromise any Faraday cages in its design, making it vulnerable to electromagnetic pulses.

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orenshved

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #27 on: June 25, 2020, 09:29:28 pm »
@orenshved You missed my post :( ?

I did  ;D thanks for all your input!

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orenshved

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #28 on: June 25, 2020, 09:37:09 pm »
I wonder if sections of pipes under roads, or in the walls of buildings could be turned into extremely powerful induction heaters. It might work if good pipe geometries could be found, and if the pipe casings were conductive (steel, copper, aluminum). Faucets could then be opened for active water cooling. This could heat up metal components in the AI, which might, among other things, compromise any Faraday cages in its design, making it vulnerable to electromagnetic pulses.
Thanks! interesting direction :)

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hakobian

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Re: How can a human defeat a super intelligent AGI
« Reply #29 on: July 01, 2021, 11:34:08 am »
Maybe give it in AI without super learning.  just give it a little learning and a bit of time.   There is a B Rated cult classic, Screamers *1995*  "In the year 2078, the planet Sirius 6B, once a thriving mining hub, ....."